Why is it that restaraunt workers do not .....

[rubberducky]

make minimum wage?? In MI the minimum wage was raised to $6.85 recently, but restaraunt workers remain at $2.50. They are required to hand over tips to bring thier wages up to the minimum, but then they are taxed on that amount. I only found out about this a week ago, but it`s really bothering me. It seems that the employers are lying about this. A waitress told me about it, but when I questioned a manager I was told " Oh, no it`s the law that all of our people are paid minimum wage". But, this is a lie. If the workers were paid minimum wage plus thier tips they would be making a half way decent living. Is this a common practice?? It seems so absolutely unfair. I had always believed that when I gave a tip it was for a job well done, not part of thier wages. This just seems so wrong to me and I don`t think many people know about this, but I can`t seem to let it go without an explanation of why these people seem to be exempted from minimum wage laws. I have always been a decent tipper, but I never realized I was partially paying thier wages. My son lives in NC and says it is the same way down there. Is there something radically wrong with this picture or is it just me?

[Rabrrrrrr]

1. They ARE paid minimum wage. Don't be fooled to think they aren't.

(well, I'm sure there are some restaurants, like any business, that violates the law, but one can safely say that, yes, restaurants DO pay minimum wage).

The problem is that the minimum wage for waiters - and waiters specifically - is much less than the minimum wage for anyone else. Something on the order of $2.50 an hour.

Which, of course, is bullshit, but that's how it works.

Not a big deal in fancy restaurants where the waiters are making hundreds a night in tips, but for the local diner waiters, it's a hardship.

But, because they earn tips, the Feds believe it's okay to give them a lower minimum wage than anyone else.

[rubberducky]

9. I, just find this unbelievable that these people can remain

so underpaid.

[Rabrrrrrr]

15. Me, too. I think it's reprehensible that we allow it.

And I think the Dems should work toward eliminating the lower minimum wage for restaurant workers.

[the other one]

2. When I was a waiter

the pay was $2.02 per hour plus tips, and tips were always computed to at $5.48 per hour; thus I paid taxes on $7.50 per hour NO MATTER WHAT the actual pay was. If I had a good day I was undertaxed, If I had a bad day I was overtaxed.

[rubberducky]

4. I have to say that I`m shocked by this.

It is so totally not fair.

[sweetheart]

7. Yep

i recall working long afternoon shifts nobody else wanted to work and getting
paid really 2 dollars an hour, plus sidework (unpaid kitchen work expected after
a shift ends). Those shifts were not worth the travel to work and the laundry
costs of washing the uniform.

[Gormy Cuss]

20. That is illegal, naturally.

When employees can demonstrate that the average tips won't bring the wage up to the regular minimum wage the Federal law dictates that the employer must make up the difference. The problem of course is that the burden of proof is on the employee and since so many tips are in cash it's hard to document them and it's rarely if ever enforced.

It's long past time to get rid of these tipped worker minimums.

[KansDem]

10. Same thing here...

10 years ago I worked as a bartender at a comedy club. While we had a full-service bar, we also did a large business in soft drinks and snacks as this was a family-oriented comedy club. I worked Wednesday night through Sunday. On the really big nights I made pretty good tips (lots of drinkers on Friday and Saturday), but on the off-nights I sometimes left without anything (like Wednesday and Sunday--customers getting cokes, popcorn, or candy bars didn't tip as they viewed me as a concessions stand and not a bar). About this time, Congress passed a law which deducted a certain percentage from my "tips" for taxes. These were hypothetical tips, of course. So on Wednesdays and Sundays, I made less in my hourly wage due to the percentage of all these hypothetical tips that went to the government as taxes.

:grr:

[no_hypocrisy]

3. I would guess that it's based on the assumption that at least

the wait staff gets tips which supplement an otherwise substandard wage. But I have not had the experience of hearing a waitress or a waiter extol about their significant tips. If anything, they get paltry if any tips when the diner seeks to punish the cook for his/her food or an inordinate amount of time waiting for the food from the kitchen. I have no problem leaving 20 percent tips just for that reason, knowing the waiter/waitress is struggling for their compensation.

[KatieBloom]

5. Tipped Employees in California...

are paid minimum wage but I think the law varies from state to
state.

[Warpy]

16. During my brief but abortive wait staff career

the restaurant had to average the half minimum wage with the tips collected over the shift and make up the difference if it fell below minimum wage.

This was in NC.

Whoopee.

[Captain Hilts]

6. Fine at an expensive restaurant, but not in a diner. nt

[Captain Hilts]

8. Many businesses and occupations are exempt from Fed. Min. wage laws.

I worked in the NY Mets AAA ballpark for below minimum wage. How they got exempt I do not know.

I worked in my university library for below minimum wage also. Again, why/how they are exempt beats the hell outta me.

[rubberducky]

12. I have to say that this leaves me speachless.

How can this be tolerated??

[Karenca]

11. I was a waitress - New York City - in 1990.

( I lasted about one week).
My pay was 90 cents an hour (plus tips).

[unpossibles]

13. sad and true

and for anyone out there who has to open or close, or set up banquets, that is work done without tips.

It's total bullshit and the reason you have to piss me off pretty badly to get less than 20%. I never stiff people either, because sometimes mistakes happen and it's not the server's fault. I served very briefly, and decided to work in the kitchen instead, but I am in full support of servers.

Pet peeve: going out with cheapskates who throw down 5 or 10% of their share if that. I always make up for it on my tip, but it still sucks. Worse, is going out with my folks or the inlaws and seeing them drop a dollar tip on a $20 meal. Once this happened, and I had no cash on me (it was a cash only diner) and made a stink about it. My mother in law added another dollar, which is a little better I guess....

:sigh:

[Warpy]

14. The restaurant pays them $2.50/hour

and averages those hours over a shift. If the worker hasn't made the equivalent of $5.15 over the shift period, the restaurant kicks in whatever it takes to bring them up to that princely $5.15.

That means there are a lot of wait staff in 24 hour restaurants who are making do on bare minimum a lot of the time, since a lot of their time is spent cleaning, filling condiment containers on table, and other non tip generating work.

Being wait staff is one of the toughest jobs out there, heavy physical work plus all the shit you can eat. That it's so poorly paid in most places is disgraceful. There are generally no benefits at all. If you don't work, you don't get paid and if you get sick, it's your problem.

The restaurant industry is one that's been long overdue for changes. Until that happens (like never), please tip generously. That person who has checked your food coming out of the kitchen to make sure it's the usual quality and what you ordered, who visits your table several times (when your mouth is full) to ask if everything's OK and if you need anything more is depending on your monetary appreciation. Please provide it. The restaurant won't.

I tried to do the job. I lasted 3 weeks.

[rubberducky]

17. God, this breaks my heart, because I know people...

who will leave a 2 penny tip for what they consider bad service or bad food.

[KSU Wildcat]

18. Why would anyone work in

the restaurant trade??? There are many crafts and trades that are begging for people with skills and trades ie carpenters,electricians, book keeper/accountants, secretarial, auto mechanics, diesel mechanics, plumbers, heating/air techs, sheet metal mechanics, health care workers, and the list goes on and on. Some require some schooling and others on the job training. If you are going to work somewhere you might as well work at a job where you are getting experience doing a salable craft or skill. If restaurants have trouble hiring enough help you can be sure they will be forced to pay more.

I know I will get flamed for this but facts are facts.

[rubberducky]

19. I think we are talking about people who do not think they have ....

skills. Trade schools are very expensive here in MI.

[KSU Wildcat]

26. There are many skilled trade jobs

where the skilled craftsman needs a helper. By helping a skilled tradesman you will be learning. Trade schools may be expensive in the short term but in the long term learning a trade or craft is very valuable even if you must take out a student loan.

For the most part the experience slinging hash in a greasy spoon is worthless.

[sweetheart]

31. it depends how old you are

Nobody wants middle aged apprentices.

I don't see why food service should be a job people eschew. Its a job some people really
like, and if it paid fairly, somebody gotta do it. I did not like the smoking, working
in the smoking section as a nonsmoker worker, but when people tipped enough to make my
pay enough to actually break even, i enjoyed the work. Its nice to be appreciated, and
there is simply no reason that food service, which is really one of the most hard jobs,
that that job should pay less than a living wage.

It was the lowest pay i ever earned (waiting tables for dennys), and the hardest work i've
ever done. Shiftwork at a 24 hour restaurant, for the odd hours of shifts, really was exhausting.

I give big tips, just 'cuz i can't forget how it feels, i hope all progressives leave extra big tips,
just to show waitstaff that they are valued more than the paltry wage, and to make up for the
assholes at the next table who are all too often, cheapo republicans.

[Warpy]

22. All those jobs take EDUCATION because we no longer use

apprenticeships to train people in trades. If somebody wants to be any of the above, s/he has to take on debt for the education and find a way of supporting him/herself while going to school.

Wait staff jobs are one of the main jobs out there for students.

If they don't have a high school diploma or GED, that education is closed to them. Again, a wait staff position doesn't depend on having paper. Some have enough energy to do the job and get a GED and more education. Most don't. It's hard, miserable work.

Facts are facts. Time to face a few.

[KSU Wildcat]

25. It is up to the individual.

If they are going to take the easy way out and make excuses for not having a skill then they are going to be doomed to low end, low wage jobs for the rest of their life. Granted education is expensive and they may have to take out a student loan but look what the alternative is.

One thing that is absolutely certain, slinging hash in a greasy spoon is about as dead end as you can get. If you make the decision that is all you can do, that is what you are going to be doomed to do for the rest of your life. Even working at Walmart pays more than restaurant work and has more of a future.

[Warpy]

27. Um, excuse me? Have you EVER tried to work a physically

and emotionally demanding job for little pay and tried to go to school at the same time? Have you had a hungry kid at home while you were doing it?

Don't post stuff like this unless you've walked in somebody else's shoes.

Bye.

[KSU Wildcat]

29. It is time for her to change jobs....

She would make more money and have a better future at Walmart, better yet get a job where you are learning a salable skill..

[Vanje]

28. "its up to the individual"

How dare she take the "easy way out"' and not have parents buy her tuition, books board and lodging at a decent school!
If she wanted to do something useful with her life, she would have inherited some wealth, by God!
How hard is THAT?

[KSU Wildcat]

30. It is never easy....

Get a job where you are learning a salable skill. Get a student loan to learn a trade. Working at a restaurant as a waiter is a dead end job. If you like waiting tables....fine, that is a choice a person has to make and there is not really any future in it even if they raise the minimum wage.

I know several people that put their self through college. It took sacrifice and determination on their part. One person took 10 years to make it but he says it was well worth the effort.

[On the Road]

21. There Was a Time

when some restaurant jobs were unpaid and tips were the only compensation. I suspect that the reduced minimum wage was a compromise measure.

I've worked as a waiter for the reduced minimum wage, and it really wasn't an issue as long as the tips were decent. In a decent place on weekend nights you can make a killing, and the paycheck is an afterthought. It becomes a problem for small places with poor tips or good places at off-times (weekday lunches) where employees are forced to work to get the better nights. There's a lot of favoritism in restaurants and it doesn't always work out.

Non-tip workers should never get a reduced wage, though, even if sharing tips is customary.

[rubberducky]

23. Tipped workers should not be subject to.........

a reduced minimum wage. If you had made minimum wages PLUS your tips you would have made a decent wage. My tips should NOT be part of your wage.

[On the Road]

24. I Wouldn't Argue That --

It's a big deal for some jobs. However, if you're making over $200 for a seven-hour shift, the extra $10 on your paycheck ($7 after withholding) is an afterthought, especially if you don't pay taxes on the tips, as most waiters don't.

I do object to practices where the waiting staff is not only forced to share tips with cooks and busboys, but those tips are then used to justify below-minimum wages for those other workers. The worst offenses I know of in this area are in the area of the "hatcheck girls" of the early 20th century. There was a tip bowl prominently displayed and often full, but the attendants had to turn over ALL tips to management, which even used statistical analysis to detect employees dipping into the bowl. That's both deceptive and abusive.

Some of the other exceptions are also pretty egregious. I've worked for below-minimum wage at a college work-study job and at the beach during the summer. College might be a special case, but seasonal work is for some reason exempt from minimum-wage laws in many states, and I can't see why it's less worthy of decent pay.