Is the abortion issue an emotional smokescreen ?

[beam me up scottie]

Are the war and the economy more important?
Do you believe women in this country would be able to stop the reichwing from taking away our reproductive freedoms?
And if I answer no to the above questions, am I acting like a victim?

[BlueEyedSon]

1. Of course.... that and gay marriage!

[beam me up scottie]

2. Thank you!

That's what I thought.
Whenever I hear somebody say "Don't worry, we'll take care of you after we win." I get VERY worried.

[BlueEyedSon]

11. The struggle over legislating RELIGIOUS morality is killing this country!!

[beam me up scottie]

13. Their idea of morality scares me to death.

And the fact that they're still at it and will stop at nothing to create a fascist theocracy should alarm everybody.

Today it's gay and women's rights, who are they coming for tomorrow?



“The greatest tragedy in mankind's entire history may be
the hijacking of morality by religion.”
Arthur C. Clarke

[BlueEyedSon]

15. Thanks for the ACC quote. nt

[beam me up scottie]

16. You're welcome.

As an atheist it's always been one of my favorites!

[liberal N proud]

3. The abortion issue is the stand-by get the right to life vote

when ever necessary.
They (the repukes) will never go so far as to touch abortion unless they are sure they will have complete and total control and never have to worry about elections again.
It is the issue they can always be in support of to insure that a large number of right winger will vote for them.
The ban abortion and they loose that group soon after, because they will no longer have the hook in them.

[beam me up scottie]

4. The reichwing women will never have to worry

about abortion.
If it's re-criminalized, they will just have their private physicians quietly perform the procedure the same way they did before Roe v. Wade.

[Lerkfish]

5. its an emotional hot button for bigots and misogynists...

that the republican party trots out at election time to "rile up the faithful".
As such, if they were anywhere close to smart, they'd never completely address the issues of abortion and gay rights, else they'd have no whip to bring their constituents to the proper froth to vote mindlessly.

IMHO

[beam me up scottie]

7. After the Terri Schaivo debacle

I really wonder.
Look how many put their political careers on the line for that right-to-life case.
And it doesn't seem to have cost them anything.

[Lerkfish]

9. yeah, but did they ACTUALLY do anything?

don't you think the party of lawyers would have known beforehand the law as penned would not survive scrutiny?

I think its sort of like when I was a kid and offered to wash the dishes for my mom, as she put the last one in the sink. You get brownie points but you don't have to really do anything.

[beam me up scottie]

10. That is a good point and

wish I could believe that but abortion and birth control are about control, not babies.
After the last four years I believe that these people think they can get away with anything, because they have up until now.

[Lerkfish]

17. no disagreement there, I've stated that before and often that its about

CONTROL.
has nothing to do with sanctity of life, else these same bozos would oppose capital punishment and war as well. They don't, so it isnt.

It has to do, IMHO, with controlling the reproductive organs of women, against their will.
Its a form of sexual slavery...or reproductive slavery, whichever.
It is completely misogynist IMHO and the reason i say that is they NEVER mention the father of the child, unless you press them, and then only relunctantly. Even so, they think the fathers should be "responsible" in some vague way, but stop short of demanding they raise the unwanted child. Also, they want to simultaneously refer to the woman as having loose morals or ethics if they get pregnant...so its a no win situation for women as far as fundies are concerned. Add to that the fact that most anti-choice fundie movements are headed by pasty white men with evangelist bowl cuts and you see where I'm going here.

now, your second point I also agree with: that they think they can get away with anything.
My only point was that, if they were smart, they'd realize taking abortion off the table as a campaign issue would lose elections for them, because if they can't whip up into a voter frenzy the mindless drones by reminding them to hate gays, hate women, hate women's reproductive organs, hate blacks and affirmative action, hate liberals and their ecoterrorism, hate brown arabs and call for their extinction......well, if'n they ACTUALLY eliminate those hot button emotional issues, they can kiss their careers goodbye because then their general rape and pillage will become more evident in other categories.

but, they will continue to APPEAR to address these issues, without ever actually resolving them to the fundie satisfaction, IMHO.

[beam me up scottie]

18. Ah, gotcha!

:think:
I thought you were saying that rw'ers would lose women voters if they took the issue off the table.
Now I get what you're saying and you're right, of course.
They are using abortion like they use threats of terrorism.

[Lerkfish]

21. LOL! good, glad we connected on that...

yes, precisely, they are using hatred and fear as goads to mindless voters...
visceral nonthinking stuff.
vote for us or die in a horrible terrorist attack!
vote for us or Gays will be treated like real people!
vote for us or evil women will be in control of their own reproduction!
vote for us so we can annihilate brown people who had nothing to do with attacking us!

yadda yadda yadda....

If nothing else, this administration has taken manipulative propaganda and fear mongering to a high (meaning low) art.

I don't admire them for it, but it is a caution that we should be aware of precisely what they are doing, here.
Rovian tactics are seldom straight line attacks. They are usually passive aggressive feints or empty promises to right some perceived wrong that doesn't materialize, and then is excused by blaming others...
its really like the US is now the world's largest dysfunctional family. Sick. Twisted.

[beam me up scottie]

22. I also think that they are using abortion

like a bone to be thrown to the religious zealots as a reward for using their brainwashing techniques and facilities.

If they succeed, will the fascists devour the zealots?
If so, I hope I'm around to see it.

[politicaholic]

6. Yes, it seems raising the deficit and perpetuating the war need no debate.

I guess we're all in agreement that if you raise these kinds of questions then you don't support the troops and you might as well just move to France (which apparently in 2003 made an over night transformation from a beautiful country ripe with culture and history to an evil wasteland full of traitorous untrustworthy ghouls that get drunk on wine, don't take baths, and backstab each other when darkness falls).

It's really pathetic that the deficit seems to some people in the house and senate to be a good thing. Since when did americans begin to elect people who can't add? Oh...that's right...1980.

[beam me up scottie]

8. I'm pretty damn concerned

about the war since a family member ships out to Falluja next month.
He still thinks freedom of choice is just as important as it ever was.
I am just unwilling to sacrifice the rights of some in order to win.

[IrishDemocrat]

12. Of course

Why else would dumb working people vote for Bush? Because of the estate tax repeal?

[beam me up scottie]

14. No, silly!

Because he's going to save Social Security!
:evilgrin:

[politicaholic]

19. I'm damn concerned also...

My best friend just got back from Baghdad two months ago. He does not support the war what-so-ever and plans to desert or object if they send him on a third tour.

Iraq is unwinable. It's as if the Iraqi army are fighting for Iraqi democracy and the insurgents are fighting a holy war. How can a war end when both sides can't even agree to why they're fighting?

[beam me up scottie]

20. We really stepped in it.

All the experts predicted this would happen if we created a power vacuum in Iraq.
Good for your friend. I hope he doesn't have to refuse orders-they'll label him a coward and a traitor but at least he will be able to live with himself.
My brother won't refuse, unfortunately. He believes since he signed up for the Guards, he should do his duty and go.