General Discussion

branford

(4,462 posts)

158. You don't understand the nature of constitutional jurisprudence

Sat Dec 5, 2015, 05:05 PM

Dec 2015

and scrutiny of laws affecting constitutional rights. Onerous administrative and financial impediments to exercising a right are treated little differently in court than bans, for that is clearly the intent of such laws.

What you want, apart from the fact that it's politically impossible in Congress and most states and localities, is most certainly not legally "easy peasy." If it was, anti-gun jurisdictions would never include the ubiquitous "grandfather" provisions in their gun control regulations.

If you want Japan-style gun control in the USA, you will need to repeal the 2a (and the analogs in virtually all state constitutions), and then obtain sufficient popular and electoral support to pass such legislative restrictions (to say nothing of actual enforcement and compliance). Since a Democratic Senate couldn't even pass UBC's, despite claiming 90% popular support and the death of 20 children at Sandy Hook, you'll need far more than luck to achieve your goals.

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We will not live in a free society if we continue to allow gun access to anyone with a pulse. [View all] boston bean Dec 2015 OP

K&R octoberlib Dec 2015 #1

I already live in a free safe society, GGJohn Dec 2015 #2

But, you'll be freer if you give up some of your freedom pintobean Dec 2015 #3

Double plus freedom... TipTok Dec 2015 #5

The response to this by some, I assume like you, is to arm more people. boston bean Dec 2015 #4

You do know the definition of a strawman argument, right? shadowrider Dec 2015 #6

You're keeping all your precious is infringing on my freedom. boston bean Dec 2015 #7

Oh bullshit. GGJohn Dec 2015 #9

Your defense of your right to "freedom" is infringing upon others rights, and boston bean Dec 2015 #11

I love how you put freedom in quotation marks, like it's not a real freedom. GGJohn Dec 2015 #17

Your right and fight to own them makes society less safe. boston bean Dec 2015 #22

No, it doesn't. GGJohn Dec 2015 #26

Ah... This was the classic argument I came to see... intersectionality Dec 2015 #48

I wake up every morning to the sound of gunshots... meaculpa2011 Dec 2015 #51

And that argument will result in the Defeat of Hillary Clinton hollowdweller Dec 2015 #96

No, that would be the criminal misuse of firearms. pintobean Dec 2015 #13

No, I am not accusing anyone of committing a crime. boston bean Dec 2015 #19

I live in one of the most dangerous cities in the country pintobean Dec 2015 #29

Straw man lark Dec 2015 #58

Pffft pintobean Dec 2015 #65

Unfortunately, lots of gun owners think any laws are demonizing. lark Dec 2015 #71

You accused me of straw man? pintobean Dec 2015 #79

They are ok to own, as long as you can pass the extensive background check GGJohn Dec 2015 #82

"Lots of gun owners are totally irresponsible" Lizzie Poppet Dec 2015 #121

Only because you're letting it. Lizzie Poppet Dec 2015 #14

The fear is coming from those who think they need these weapons for security. boston bean Dec 2015 #16

Okay, I'm obviously wasting my time. Lizzie Poppet Dec 2015 #18

+1000 smirkymonkey Dec 2015 #139

Tell that to the hundreds of Americans who have lost a loved one to gun violence. lark Dec 2015 #64

No one's claiming it's "imaginary." Lizzie Poppet Dec 2015 #69

Maybe you live in the country? lark Dec 2015 #72

I live downtown in a fairly big city. Lizzie Poppet Dec 2015 #84

Gun deaths are at historically low levels. hollowdweller Dec 2015 #100

Indeed so, and when I point that out... Lizzie Poppet Dec 2015 #109

Facts: Spider Jerusalem Dec 2015 #193

If you don't want a gun, don't buy one. Simple! yeoman6987 Dec 2015 #128

Total bull hockey. My firearms are not at all infringing on your freadoms Waldorf Dec 2015 #136

+1000 nt Mojorabbit Dec 2015 #145

You really should get your money back for that internet psychology course you took. GGJohn Dec 2015 #8

You're defense of your precious rights superceding every other right boston bean Dec 2015 #10

Assault rifles? GGJohn Dec 2015 #12

I'm fine... you might need some education though... boston bean Dec 2015 #15

It's still not an assault rifle, GGJohn Dec 2015 #21

What does the AR stand for in AR-15? nt boston bean Dec 2015 #23

branding DustyJoe Dec 2015 #24

Armalite Rifle. GGJohn Dec 2015 #25

You want me to argue semantics of gun language. boston bean Dec 2015 #27

LOL. GGJohn Dec 2015 #28

I got caught, so sue me. boston bean Dec 2015 #30

I have no desire to sue you, GGJohn Dec 2015 #31

I hope you will stop making your mistakes too. nt boston bean Dec 2015 #34

What mistakes? eom. GGJohn Dec 2015 #35

Fighting for more access to more killing machines in the name of freedom. boston bean Dec 2015 #36

Ah, but that's not what I'm doing, GGJohn Dec 2015 #38

Your fight only leads to it. Feel better? OK... boston bean Dec 2015 #39

So you don't think law abiding citizens should have the right to decide GGJohn Dec 2015 #42

I think a lot of people do stupid things. boston bean Dec 2015 #46

But suppose they don't think it's stupid? GGJohn Dec 2015 #49

Each and every single victim of this proliferation of mass killing machines in the name of freedom boston bean Dec 2015 #50

NO lark Dec 2015 #67

Lol aikoaiko Dec 2015 #33

Come on... everyone KNOWS it's "Assault Rifle Fifteen". n/t cherokeeprogressive Dec 2015 #130

Armalite rifle Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #47

Who cares? lark Dec 2015 #75

If one is going to propose legislation, GGJohn Dec 2015 #80

I don't think that the details of the guns matter, no. lark Dec 2015 #107

"..gun ownership in this country is driving us to be the 2nd tier murder capital of the world" EX500rider Dec 2015 #102

I do when people continue Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #104

AR stands for Armalite, the company who orignially designed the firearm back in the 50's. Waldorf Dec 2015 #137

Again, half truths., lark Dec 2015 #61

The hell conversion kits aren't banned, tell the ATF that. GGJohn Dec 2015 #76

Don'tcha just love all the untrue facts... beevul Dec 2015 #115

yep the outright lies Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #122

comprehension DustyJoe Dec 2015 #20

There is, however, a definite legal definition of an assault rifle. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #191

We are fortunate that we live in a state that has one of the lowest rates smirkymonkey Dec 2015 #37

You are making the rest of us, including your family, less safe. lark Dec 2015 #53

All our firearms are locked up in safes seperate from the ammo, which has it's own safe. eom. GGJohn Dec 2015 #133

No kidding. This OP is over the top yeoman6987 Dec 2015 #127

Agreed, only dead people should be allowed gun access. nt Live and Learn Dec 2015 #32

Is THAT your response to a post asking for accepting some limits to gun ownership in CTyankee Dec 2015 #40

The OP wants to ban and confiscate guns. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #43

She said no such thing in her post. CTyankee Dec 2015 #44

Read her other posts. eom MohRokTah Dec 2015 #52

Why would that concern you? pintobean Dec 2015 #54

Oh, I don't know. I just thought it was a funny thing to say... CTyankee Dec 2015 #59

I didn't. pintobean Dec 2015 #66

So, you are part of the problem then. lark Dec 2015 #78

No, gun confiscators are the problem. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #81

No gun collectors who fetishize over these killing implements so much boston bean Dec 2015 #89

The RKBA is an enumerated right in the constitution. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #91

And limiting the type of guns is not an infringement. boston bean Dec 2015 #93

So as long as you can have just 1 book, of someone elses choosing... beevul Dec 2015 #118

The FBI can place anyone on the "No-Fly" list... meaculpa2011 Dec 2015 #90

Guns are not being used bought by people in well-regulated militias. lark Dec 2015 #98

No, you do not support the constitution. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #99

Two can play lark Dec 2015 #101

I disagree with CU. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #103

Wrong is wrong. lark Dec 2015 #110

I REFUSE to support ANY amendment to the constitution which alters ANY of the first ten amendments MohRokTah Dec 2015 #111

"Bet you think terrorists should be able to buy guns too" pintobean Dec 2015 #97

The OP stated that we shouldn't allow gun access to ANYONE with a pulse. Live and Learn Dec 2015 #68

Why do so many people on both the left and the right despise the consitution? MohRokTah Dec 2015 #41

what does that even mean? Fast Walker 52 Dec 2015 #55

What a ridiculous thing to say. Chef Eric Dec 2015 #86

You will NEVER see the second amendment repealed. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #88

You're 100% right, because by the time it happens, I will be dead. Chef Eric Dec 2015 #94

I dare you to take guns away NYCButterfinger Dec 2015 #45

Then we need to regulate ownership like Japan does. VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #57

sounds good to me! CTyankee Dec 2015 #60

That would do nothing for the millions who already own them. NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #74

They would not be grandfathered VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #92

Pssst... speed limits don't prevent ANY speeding. Everyone drives at the speed they're comfortable cherokeeprogressive Dec 2015 #132

I would, especially on certain roads around where I live. NobodyHere Dec 2015 #134

The 4th, 5th, and 14th Amendments would likely bar your idea. branford Dec 2015 #147

Nobody said you cannot have them VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #151

You don't understand the nature of constitutional jurisprudence branford Dec 2015 #158

And if you don't go through the hoops NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #165

You can still speed and run redlights VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #167

Different matter all together. NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #169

Yes you can....we already do... VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #174

Your talking about business regulation (professions and sales) NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #179

We can do anything if we want to... VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #182

Are you going to overthrow the Government? NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #184

I don't have to....we have elections VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #185

Hillary isn't a threat to ownership. NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #186

Did I say that? VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #187

Obviously this is just a waste of my time. NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #189

Waste of time because you know I am right.... VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #190

Now if you got caught with a prescription drug VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #175

Car inspections are legal because driving on public roads is a privilege. NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #178

Bullshit... VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #180

LOL. NutmegYankee Dec 2015 #181

Damn skippy VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #183

As long as the federal government pays for all of those things, I'm cool with it yeoman6987 Dec 2015 #135

Why should they? Do you pay to have your car VanillaRhapsody Dec 2015 #188

"Be tough and stop being afraid of a gun." Crunchy Frog Dec 2015 #62

I like the wasy you blame an inanimate object TeddyR Dec 2015 #56

Who can legally get firearms now that you think shouldn't? Recursion Dec 2015 #63

all for anyone in country on a residents visa/family of american citizen visa a ban on gun purchases Sunlei Dec 2015 #70

A good start would be to ban military-type assault rifles. jalan48 Dec 2015 #73

What is different? GGJohn Dec 2015 #87

So-educate me then. jalan48 Dec 2015 #95

they are .223 semi-auto Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #108

Thanks for the response. Also, what is the value of owning one of these guns? jalan48 Dec 2015 #112

I do not hunt Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #114

I didn't realize the Ar-10 was used for hunting. jalan48 Dec 2015 #117

probably in the 80s and 90s Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #120

A thought.... jalan48 Dec 2015 #123

nope Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #124

Allrighty, I can see where you're coming from. jalan48 Dec 2015 #125

join the club Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #126

No thanks. jalan48 Dec 2015 #129

Thank you for having an open mind.. virginia mountainman Dec 2015 #171

very true Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #172

Duckhunter.... virginia mountainman Dec 2015 #170

I have a LR-308 that fires a .308 cartridge, and shoots just as accurate as my .308 bolt rifle. Waldorf Dec 2015 #140

Did you know anybody who used an M-1 Garand? nadinbrzezinski Dec 2015 #144

+1000. GGJohn Dec 2015 #148

Thank you for the civil conversation, GGJohn Dec 2015 #173

But it's fair to mention that when most people think of "a .22," they're thinking... Lizzie Poppet Dec 2015 #113

very true, thanks Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #116

it's a good thing Duckhunter935 Dec 2015 #105

Except the stores aren't selling those military-type assault rifles. Need to join the military or Waldorf Dec 2015 #138

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2015 #163

I completely agree with you, and don't think most of your respondents Crunchy Frog Dec 2015 #77

Yes, thanks for responding. boston bean Dec 2015 #85

agreed. K and R. NRaleighLiberal Dec 2015 #83

Should our future sarisataka Dec 2015 #106

No, because it won't stop someone on that list from obtaining a firearm from a friend 951-Riverside Dec 2015 #131

The OP was about reduction sarisataka Dec 2015 #141

it amazes me that this needs to be said out loud in 2015 restorefreedom Dec 2015 #119

One of the reasons people are against universal background checks (and I am one of them) is because Waldorf Dec 2015 #142

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2015 #164

what is the current issue restorefreedom Dec 2015 #195

Of course you are right, Boston, but as we all know the gungeoneers won't let you say it without a Squinch Dec 2015 #143

Really? GGJohn Dec 2015 #150

Translation: Nyah nyah! Squinch Dec 2015 #152

Translation: I can't refute, so I belittle. GGJohn Dec 2015 #153

Translation: Nyah, nyah and double nyah nyah! With laughing guy! So there! Squinch Dec 2015 #154

LOL. GGJohn Dec 2015 #156

Translation: I need to have the last word! Nyah! Nyah! Nyah!!! With laughing guy! Squinch Dec 2015 #159

Yes. Boy do I hate gun nuts. alarimer Dec 2015 #146

So much nonsense in so many words. GGJohn Dec 2015 #149

Truth: a large number of gun owners own guns due to fear, paranoia and masculinity issues. LonePirate Dec 2015 #157

Got any stats on your claim? GGJohn Dec 2015 #160

Are you one of those who propagates the nonsensical "guns keep us safe" claptrap? LonePirate Dec 2015 #166

I've never stated that guns keep us safe, GGJohn Dec 2015 #168

There are many changes that are needed at a policy level nadinbrzezinski Dec 2015 #155

I'm already free and safe. Hyperbole doesn't sway me LittleBlue Dec 2015 #161

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2015 #162

I have ask several times what would the solution the would suggest to get the mass shootings stopped Thinkingabout Dec 2015 #176

I need... deathrind Dec 2015 #177

Hi Ms bean discntnt_irny_srcsm Dec 2015 #192

I suspect you may have it backwards. Just my opinion. n/t Yo_Mama Dec 2015 #194