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ancianita

(42,096 posts)
Sat Mar 19, 2022, 03:13 PM Mar 2022

Putin's Hypersonic Missiles Should be Announced by the West As Escalation [View all]

Russia's missiles are unseeable, unstoppable, and nuclear capable. That right there is escalation. Of course, the idea is that the West has to cower in fear at this spectre of nuclear annihilation. Putin gives the likely story that he only developed these weapons because the West forced him to, because the US withdrew from the Anti Ballistic Missile Treaty in 2002. The US is third in hypersonic missiles, behind Russia and China.

Perhaps this is the pivot point of support for Russia by China. In that sense, their pincer formation could become stronger. Could they both strike? Yes. But in the economic sense, the cost to China of supporting Russia is not really worth China's short and long term economic weakening.

This is just the Zircon...

Hypersonic weapons such as Russia's 3M22 Zircon fly so fast and low -- at speeds of up to Mach 6 and at a low atmospheric-ballistic trajectory -- that they can penetrate traditional anti-missile defense systems.

The missile flies with an advanced fuel that the Russians say gives it a range of up to 1,000 kilometers. And it's so fast that the air pressure in front of the weapon forms a plasma cloud as it moves, absorbing radio waves and making it practically invisible to active radar systems.

U.S. Aegis missile interceptor systems require 8-10 seconds of reaction time to intercept incoming attacks. In those 8-10 seconds, the Russian Zircon missiles will already have traveled 20 kilometers, and the interceptor missiles do not fly fast enough to catch up.

According to Popular Mechanics, even if a U.S. ship were to detect a Zircon missile from 100 miles away, it would have only one minute to do something about it.

In order to intercept a Russian Zircon missile, the U.S. would either need to intercept it at launch or fly an object into its path.

Russia's shift to hypersonic weapons is likely a means of contending with American superiority in size, technology and sheer number of aircraft carriers. The U.S. Navy intends to maintain a force of 12 nuclear-powered aircraft carriers.

By contrast, Russia has one -- and it deploys with a tugboat in case its engine breaks down.

While at sea, any of Russia's 15 Buyan-class corvettes will be able to carry up to 25 Zircon hypersonic missiles. It would take fewer than a half-dozen of those missiles to sink even the most advanced American aircraft carrier, such as the USS Gerald R. Ford.

Some say that innovations like the Zircon are moving the development of military technology away from aircraft carrier-based systems, calling for the U.S. Navy to reconsider the role of the carrier entirely.



Now for the nuclear capable Kinshal hypersonic ...





According to TASS, the first launch of Kinzhal in the Arctic took place mid-November, 2019. Reportedly, the launch was carried out by a MiG-31K from Olenya air base. The missile hit a ground target at "Pemboy" proving ground, reaching the speed of Mach 10.[31] In June 2021, a Kinzhal missile was launched by a MiG-31K from Khmeimim Air Base, on a ground target in Syria.[32] A separate aviation regiment has been formed, armed with MiG-31K aircraft with the Kinzhal hypersonic missile in 2021.[33]

Rumours in early February 2022 suggested that several MiG-31 interceptors armed with Kinzhal missiles were dispatched from Soltsy Air Base, Novgorod Oblast, to Chernyakhovsk Naval Air Base in Russia's western Kaliningrad exclave.[34][35][36][37] Russia's Aerospace Force launched Kinzhal hypersonic aeroballistic missiles on 19 February 2022.[38]

During the invasion of Ukraine in 2022, the missile was reportedly used for the first time in combat. The Russian military said that it used Kinzhal missiles to destroy an underground weapons depot of the Ukrainian armed forces in Deliatyn on 18 March 2022.[39][40]


And then there is the Avangard (hypersonic glide vehicle)

a Russian hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV) that can be carried as a MIRV payload by the UR-100UTTKh,[7][8] R-36M2 and RS-28 Sarmat heavy ICBMs. It can deliver both nuclear and conventional payloads.[9][10][11]

The Avangard is one of the six new Russian strategic weapons unveiled by Russian President Vladimir Putin on 1 March 2018.



China and Russia know that if they hit anywhere beyond Ukraine, they'd best get ready.
49 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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K&R! dchill Mar 2022 #1
Hypersonic missiles against US aircraft carriers NickB79 Mar 2022 #2
One minute the aircraft carrier has to live. The Javelins have been shown more successful, ancianita Mar 2022 #3
I wouldn't consider this a major escalation Abnredleg Mar 2022 #4
It is nuclear capable. Ukraine is practice. A test run. The more time we give Russia, the more ancianita Mar 2022 #6
They don't need a test run to deliver nukes Abnredleg Mar 2022 #11
Thank you. A good reason for anyone to be scared. ancianita Mar 2022 #15
And no one is fixating. Notice I brought up three systems, not one. ancianita Mar 2022 #16
When did "hypersonic" missiles become so scary? WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2022 #5
Scary? What are you trying to say? ancianita Mar 2022 #8
I'm saying that most missiles are hypersonic at some point, so "hypersonic" shouldn't be a scare WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2022 #24
So based on what you know, I should just accept a "not much to see here" explanation? ancianita Mar 2022 #27
because they're barely detectable and unstoppable. WarGamer Mar 2022 #9
That's important against carriers Abnredleg Mar 2022 #13
I think it's more about the threat... WarGamer Mar 2022 #14
I wouldn't go that far Abnredleg Mar 2022 #19
Good point... can a hypersonic missile track a 22 knot ship zig-zagging? WarGamer Mar 2022 #26
Carrier battle groups are hugely important to US military tactics NickB79 Mar 2022 #17
Targeting is going to be the issue Abnredleg Mar 2022 #20
Very good points. NickB79 Mar 2022 #23
A Kinzhal is just an air-launched Iskander, which have been used plenty over the past couple WhiskeyGrinder Mar 2022 #21
It's an expected response to the weapons shipments to Ukraine from the West. WarGamer Mar 2022 #7
Glad to get an "expected response" explanation. Didn't know that was part of war tactics. ancianita Mar 2022 #10
It's more about politics. WarGamer Mar 2022 #12
Sure. And upping our game is accusing him of escalation. If it's a wrong move by the West, ancianita Mar 2022 #18
It's not just his feudal politics, it's his 21st Century tech backing up a feudal war of attrition. ancianita Mar 2022 #22
I'm not sure... WarGamer Mar 2022 #25
Neither is the military, from all appearances. But this is no dress rehearsal. ancianita Mar 2022 #28
Again with the "hypersonic" missiles? It's nothing but Russian propaganda maxrandb Mar 2022 #29
It's my first time. You're welcome to ask why I posted it. You can post other links, too. ancianita Mar 2022 #30
I apologize. Wasn't meant to give you that impression maxrandb Mar 2022 #32
We're straight. ancianita Mar 2022 #33
Wow. Tree-Hugger Mar 2022 #31
US carriers top out in the 30+ knot range (56 km/h; 35 mph) EX500rider Mar 2022 #36
The "official" speed from the Navy is "in excess of 30 knots" maxrandb Mar 2022 #39
Well... EX500rider Mar 2022 #41
More jets should be patrolling the Black Sea. Where they come from is immaterial n/t AntiFascist Mar 2022 #34
How on earth would such a declaration be of any help whatsoever (Nt) FreepFryer Mar 2022 #35
Would the West's silence help in the face of Putin's use of hypersonic missiles? ancianita Mar 2022 #37
Silence and declaring this an escalation are far from the only two responses available. FreepFryer Mar 2022 #38
Great. As far as they are from the only responses, what have you got? ancianita Mar 2022 #40
Well I don't provoke others with logical fallacies. Think thru what such an announcement would do. FreepFryer Mar 2022 #44
If you don't think I've thought it through, then what would it do. ancianita Mar 2022 #45
Nope. Conversation in good faith isnt commanding others. Not cool. (Nt) FreepFryer Mar 2022 #46
"Should" isn't "Commanding" or "bad faith." Talk about illogic. ancianita Mar 2022 #47
I said if you're just going to attack, rather than converse, I'm done. Bye. (Nt) FreepFryer Mar 2022 #48
Talk about projection. You've made no-effort posts. You start with dismissal, refuse to explain ancianita Mar 2022 #49
Beginning to look like it was staged. pecosbob Mar 2022 #42
Well, good, then. Planet Lab's higher level satellite geolocation technology now gives us a clearer ancianita Mar 2022 #43
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