IDF Ignored Female Soldiers' Warnings Pre-Oct. 7. Then They Were Massacred Amanpour and Company

[Uncle Joe]

One year since the October 7th terror attack, 101 Israeli hostages are yet to be brought home from Gaza. The number includes five female soldiers who were stationed at the Nahal Oz base near the Gaza border fence that day. Hamas killed 15 in their unit. Months before the attack, the all-female unit had reported suspicious activity by Hamas, but their warnings were ignored. In a recent report for the Wall Street Journal, correspondent Anat Peled investigates that failure, the tragedy that ensued, and the wider implications. Peled joins the show to discuss.

Originally aired on October 9, 2024

[hlthe2b]

1. This is a story that leaves me absolutely cold. Was it blatant misogyny? Incompetence? Something else?

Even worse is that Netanyahu has gotten by with not investigating or answering any questions about the miserable missteps that led up to October 7, 2023. Indefensible.

[Uncle Joe]

2. My own gut feeling is that it was "something else."

There are just too many connecting dots or dynamics at play.

[Beastly Boy]

3. It is absolutely remarkable how many stories about Hamas invading Israel and killing over 1200

Israelis pay so little attention to Hamas invading Israel and killing 1200 Israelis.

[Uncle Joe]

4. That would be remarkable if time didn't exist before October 7th nor after, but no day exists in a vacuum.

Everyone knows that Hamas invaded and slaughtered over 1200 Israelis.

Everyone knows that hurricane Milton just slammed into Florida, does that mean that anthropogenic climate change affects on Milton shouldn't be taken into account?

[hlthe2b]

5. Imagine if Americans showed no interest at all/demanded no answers to how 911 could have happened

with the US seemingly so unprepared and incomprehensibly failing to communicate threats known to some to those responsible to act. Imagine if multiple credible female soldiers or officials came upon the plot and actually had transmitted their knowledge to the highest levels of US government--to the White House/Pentagon--yet their entreaties were ignored...

Imagine no one wanting to look at that, to know how that could have happened, who was responsible, how we could prevent a similar attack in the future.

Imagine...

[hlthe2b]

7. Those are YOUR words, not mine. Why do you not want to know what happened?

[Israeli]

11. We have been screaming for answers

totally completely ignored .

There were two memorials for October 7th , one organized by the relatives of the hostages and the other by Miri Regev .
One was my Israel the other was Bibi's .

If you truly want to understand us watch both .

To all Democrats I have one thing to say .......President Biden is 100% correct .
The only solution is a two state solution .

we will survive Hamas , Hezbullah and the Yemen's Houthis

but ... will we survive each other ???

The division in this country is way beyond what you are going thru with Trump .

The Only Way to Prevent Civil War in Israel Is a Return to the Oslo Path

Carolina Landsmann
Oct 11, 2024

The war stopped the civil war. In the months before Hamas' attack, energy for war was released in both Israeli political camps. Both sides were determined "to go all the way," but both kept quiet about the main bone of contention – the occupation.

The right didn't "let on" that the judicial reform's purpose is to enable the government to annex the occupied territories without giving the Palestinians citizenship, and to fix Jewish supremacy in law. The protest, in turn, didn't come out in defense of the reform's main victims – the Arabs. The protest didn't allow raising the anti-occupation flag, not to mention the Palestinian one.

Netanyahu proposed changing the war's name to the "War of Revival." The revival idea, meaning the nation's rebirth, achieved by war, was also prominent in his speech in the government October 7 memorial ceremony: "And when we win ... we'll make the sinews of revival many times stronger. The connection with our roots will make the tree of life grow again," he rhapsodized.

But there's no reason to believe that at the end of the war, Israel will be born again and succeed in fashioning a historic bypass around civil war. If the unacknowledged reason for the rift in the nation is the conflict with the Palestinians, how can it be mended without adopting a unified stand on it?

The only way to prevent the civil war that was halted on October 7 is by recognizing, amid the war that broke out that day, that we must end our rule over the Palestinians. But Netanyahu, as is his wont, wants to pick the fruit without planting a single tree. "A new birth of freedom," as Abraham Lincoln said in the Gettysburg Address during the American Civil War, only without abolishing slavery.

In his last speech in the UN, Netanyahu spoke lyrically about the blessing of peace in the Middle East, with peace with Saudi Arabia as its anchor. "It will lead to a historical reconciliation between the Arab world and Israel, between Islam and Judaism, between Mecca and Jerusalem."

He said, "Israel is committed to achieve such a peace," and the way to defeat Iran is to "achieve peace." Such a peace, he said, "will constitute the basis for an even broader Abraham Accords, and that alliance will include the United States, Israel's current Arab peace partners, Saudi Arabia and others who choose the blessing of peace." I'm sold.

But, um, the Saudis have made it clear that peace is conditional on returning to the diplomatic track on the basis of the two-state solution. If Iran is indeed the greatest threat to humanity, how could Netanyahu afford to ignore the conflict with the Palestinians, whose solution is the anchor that guarantees the allies' axis against Iran?

Last week Netanyahu addressed the Lebanese and Iranians directly, saying, "Our war isn't against you." Who did he not address? The Palestinians. In his speech in the UN, he even continued to besmirch Mahmoud Abbas, Israel's security partner for decades.

The way to the blessing of peace begins with solving the Palestinian problem. The foreign ministers of Saudi Arabia and Jordan have recently repeated this. Over the years, Benjamin Netanyahu has deceived the Israelis that peace is possible in the Middle East while ignoring the Palestinians.
From his jabbering in the UN, it seems he's continuing to throw sand in the eyes of Israelis and the world. He and his colleagues enjoy blasting the Oslo Accords at every opportunity and wave the Abraham Accords, as though they'd have been possible without the Oslo Accords.
The truth is that without returning to the Oslo track – that is, to the aspiration to two states – there will be no blessing on Israel. It won't have peace along its borders, and it won't have peace within them. It certainly won't see any revival.

Source : haaretz
Link : https://archive.md/LpWw4

[hlthe2b]

12. There are many here who NEED to hear from you so I'm glad you are weighing in...

Some of those most needing to hear an Israeli voice are on this thread, (and many others posted both in IP and GD)forums-- that include those who refuse to point any fingers at Netanyahu or his actions). So I am very happy that you are doing so.

[Israeli]

13. Ive been saying the same since

the day I joined here .

does not matter what i say but we like to think that this might have had some influence :

https://peacenow.org.il/en/peace-now-in-a-letter-to-the-president-of-the-united-states-and-the-un-secretary-general

[hlthe2b]

14. There are a large number here who are with you.

There are "vocal" others who accuse us of antisemitism for merely pointing out that our support for the Israeli people does NOT automatically equate to the same unquestioned support for Netanyahu and his policies. For some, that even extends to excoriating us when we bring up the preemptive warnings these women Israeli soldiers gave before October 7.

I realize you have been on DU for a while, but I guess I've somehow not crossed paths. Good to see you.

[Israeli]

15. There are also a large number here who are against me

simply because I am Israeli .
There are also those against me because of my Left wing politics .

Its an on line forum , Ive learnt to swallow the abuse and move on .

Living with the abuse in reality is a totally different experience tho .
Let me give you an example :

'People Say My Son Brought Oct. 7 on Himself – as if He Invited Terrorists Into His Home'

Hannah Wacholder Katsman knew that facing the anniversary of her son's death on October 7 would be difficult, but grieving in wartime Israel has been a challenge over the whole year, ever since her son was killed by Hamas terrorists in Kibbutz Holit, she said on the Haaretz Podcast.

Hayim Katsman, an American-Israeli who would have turned 33 on October 3, was a political scientist specializing in right-wing religious Zionism and a devoted peace activist, with eclectic interests and hobbies which he pursued alongside his teaching and research: gardening, music and auto mechanics. His dissertation was dedicated to "all life forms that exist between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea."

He was shot to death at his kibbutz home while protecting his next-door neighbor Avital Alajem.

His mother said that her year of mourning has included the experience of being "screamed at" while attending rallies and demonstrations in support of the families of those being held hostage in Gaza by Hamas and advocating for a deal for a cease-fire that would bring them home.

"There's just been a lot of hostility toward hostage families and toward peace activists like my son," she said, pointing to "offensive" comments from right-wing Israelis regarding victims of October 7 who were politically left-wing, "blaming the victims" for their fate.

Noting that pundits have commented that "soon they're going to say the hostages kidnapped themselves" she said she "identified" with that sentiment, "because people really are saying things like that; that Hayim brought it on himself, as if he invited all of these terrorists into his house and because he was a peace activist."

The "private and communal support that I've had over this year has been enormous," Wacholder Katsman said. But hearing sentiments disparaging her son and other victims, and experiencing the hostility at public events, has been painful.

"I am disappointed by the callousness shown toward the hostages and to some extent, toward us, the families – especially toward the hostage families. That to me, has been unfathomable, unbelievable, hurtful and painful."

She noted that in the months following her son's death, she received "a lot more support from the United States government" than from Israel's. No government representatives made in-person or phone contact with her or her family, or attended the funeral, visited her while mourning or attended memorial events.

Wacholder Katsman, who grew up in Cincinnati, where her rabbi father taught at Hebrew Union College, remains active in U.S. politics as a board member of American Democrats in Israel.

While she has focused her energy over the past year on memorializing her slain son, she said she remains engaged in the U.S. election and believes that Vice President Kamala Harris "has shown herself to be a strong supporter of Israel"

At the same time, she is worried about the "extremely, extremely troubling things that Trump has been saying about Jews, and his crazed rants at rallies. "This isn't someone we want in charge of the country. It's not going to be good for Israel: it's not going to be good for anyone if the US goes down and we go down with it. It's a very very scary situation."

Source : Haaretz
Link : https://archive.md/AQ1lz#selection-1235.0-1303.242

[Beastly Boy]

8. The story in question covers the events immediately prior to the Hamas attack and

doesn't cover events immediately following the attack.

This is the scope of the article. Other articles I am referring to cover similar time frames.

As you noted, the people who publish these stories know that Hamas invaded and slaughtered 1200 Israelis, yet they don't go beyond cursory acknowledgement of this obvious fact at best.

What they cover instead of covering details of the atrocities committed by Hamas is the details of the failures of Israeli intelligence. The details they cover skirt and obfuscate the fact of the attack itself, thus placing the blame that rightfully belongs to Hamas on Israel.

Let's face the inconvenient truth, failures of Israeli intelligence did not CAUSE the 1200 Israeli deaths, the Hamas invasion did. Israeli intelligence did not plan for the attack, it did not execute the attack with unbelievable brutality, it did nott fund the attackers. it did not train the attackers, it did not rape, burn, or take hostages. Hamas did. Any side issues that omit any mention of this context are patently disingenuous.

And I find the presumption that any diversion from these facts would be any less remarkable in the context of a greater time period pretty disturbing, whatever the time period you have in mind.

[Uncle Joe]

9. I don't know of any murder investigation that doesn't cover the immediate past,

even if it reflects poorly on the family or friends and I've seen/posted plenty of articles or videos studying the longer term Israeli/Palestinian past as well as post 10/7 events.

Time is all one continuous stream.

Hamas committed the atrocities of that day, but all manner of moral, political and policy failures contributed to 10/7, that's the inconvenient truth.

Even Jimmy Carter recognized the unjust manner in which the Palestinians were being treated by Israel.

Jimmy Carter Interviewed On Democracy Now
September 10 2007 Broadcast
Host is Amy Goodman

Part 1 of 4

In this part Carter is asked about the Carter Center, his book "Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid", and why American's do not know about what goes on in Palestine.

Sep 10, 2007

Part 2 of 4

In this part Carter is asked about when during his presidency he understood the Palestinian situation, the illegal separation wall Israel is building, and the Camp David peace offers and Bill Clinton.

Jimmy Carter Interviewed On Democracy Now
September 10 2007 Broadcast
Host is Amy Goodman

Part 3 of 4

In this part Cater is asked if he expect the response he got from his book, what does he want to see happen in Israel and Palestine, the possibility of a US attack against Iran, the effect of George Bush, and whether he regretted allowing Indonesia to buy US weapons for it's invasion of Timor.

[Aussie105]

10. Amazing!

Amazing how Israel just knows who and where the leaders of Hamas, Hezbollah etc are, and can wipe them out with a massive overkill using missiles or bombs, yet ignores pre-emptive warnings.

Intelligence failure or something else?