Judge sets Trump classified documents trial for May 2024, months before election

[BumRushDaShow]

Last edited Fri Jul 21, 2023, 12:27 PM - Edit history (2)

Source: CNBC

Former President Donald Trump’s trial on charges of mishandling classified documents will begin on May 20, 2024, a federal judge ordered Friday. Judge Aileen Cannon laid out the schedule three days after defense lawyers argued that the case should not head to trial until after the November 2024 presidential election, due to Trump’s status as a current presidential candidate.

The trial will take place in U.S. District Court in Fort Pierce, Florida, Cannon ordered. The ruling from Cannon lands on a middle ground between the requests of Trump’s legal team and the Department of Justice, which had pushed for the trial to begin in late 2023.

Polls show Trump is currently leading the 2024 Republican primary field. If the case moves forward as currently scheduled, the trial could come after a slew of key states have already held their nominating contests. The Republican National Convention, where the GOP will select its presidential nominee, is set to take place in Milwaukee in mid-July 2024. Trump’s attorney, Todd Blanche, declined to comment on the judge’s ruling.

Trump last month pleaded not guilty to 37 criminal counts related to his retention of classified documents after leaving the White House in 2021 and subsequent alleged efforts to conceal them from the government. Walt Nauta, his valet and co-defendant, has pleaded not guilty to six criminal charges.

Read more: https://www.cnbc.com/2023/07/21/judge-sets-trump-classified-documents-trial-for-may-2024-months-before-election.html

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Article updated.

Previous articles -

Former President Donald Trump's trial on charges of mishandling classified documents will begin on May 20, 2024, a federal judge ordered Friday. Judge Aileen Cannon laid out the schedule three days after defense lawyers argued that the case should not head to trial until after the November 2024 presidential election, due to Trump's status as a current presidential candidate.

The trial will take place in U.S. District Court in Fort Pierce, Florida, Cannon ordered. The ruling from Cannon lands on a middle ground between the requests of Trump's legal team and the Department of Justice, which had pushed for the trial to begin in late 2023.

Polls show Trump is currently leading the 2024 Republican primary field. If the case moves forward as currently scheduled, the trial could come after a slew of key states have already held their nominating contests. The Republican National Convention, where the GOP will select its presidential nominee, is set to take place in Milwaukee in mid-July 2024.

Trump's lawyers did not immediately respond to CNBC's requests for comment on the trial schedule. Trump last month pleaded not guilty to 37 criminal counts related to his retention of classified documents after leaving the White House in 2021 and subsequent alleged efforts to conceal them from the government. Walt Nauta, his valet and co-defendant, has pleaded not guilty to six criminal charges.

Former President Donald Trump's trial on charges of mishandling classified documents will begin on May 20, 2024, a federal judge ordered Friday. Judge Aileen Cannon laid out the schedule three days after defense lawyers argued that the case should not head to trial until after the November 2024 presidential election, due to Trump's status as a current presidential candidate.

The ruling from Cannon lands on a middle ground between the requests of Trump's legal team and the Department of Justice, which had pushed for the trial to begin in late 2023.

Polls show Trump is currently leading the 2024 Republican primary field. If the case moves forward as currently scheduled, the trial could come after a slew of key states have already held their nominating contests.

Trump last month pleaded not guilty to 37 criminal counts related to his retention of classified documents after leaving the White House in 2021 and subsequent alleged efforts to conceal them from the government. Walt Nauta, his valet and co-defendant, has pleaded not guilty to six criminal charges.

Former President Donald Trump's trial on charges of mishandling classified documents will begin on May 20, 2024, a federal judge ordered Friday.

Judge Aileen Cannon laid out the schedule three days after defense lawyers argued that the case should not head to trial until after the November 2024 presidential election, due to Trump's status as a current presidential candidate.

The ruling from Cannon lands on a middle ground between the requests of Trump's legal team and the Department of Justice, which had pushed for the trial to begin in late 2023.

Polls show Trump is currently leading the 2024 Republican primary field. If the case moves forward as currently scheduled, the trial could come after a slew of key states have already held their nominating contests.


This is breaking news. Please check back for updates.

Former President Donald Trump's trial on charges of mishandling classified documents will begin on May 20, 2024, a federal judge ordered Friday.

Judge Aileen Cannon laid out the schedule three days after defense lawyers argued that the case should not head to trial until after the November 2024 presidential election, due to Trump's status as a current presidential candidate.

The ruling from Cannon, a Trump appointee, lands on a middle ground between the requests of Trump's legal team and the Department of Justice, which had pushed for the trial to begin in late 2023.


This is breaking news. Please check back for updates.

A federal judge has set former President Donald Trump's trial on charges of mishandling classified documents to start May 20, 2024, a court filing showed Friday.


This is breaking news. Please check back for updates.

Original article -

This is breaking news. Please check back for updates.

[bucolic_frolic]

1. She's made Trump safe. Delays will move that months forward.

Dismissal or acquittal right around election time. This is grossly inadequate in my opinion.

[jaxexpat]

37. This is exactly what we all should have expected.

You're at least 60% right. But the fact remains there's a better than even chance Trump will skate on this like he's skated on everything else in his entire misbegotten life.

Delusions Democrats are fond of:
>We all saw it on live TeeVee, Trump will never beat this insurrection rap.
>He tried to extort the Georgis AG into creating 1200 fake votes for him on a recorded call, got him dead to rights.
>His indictment will totally derail his election campaign and bring him to justice.
>The classified documents scandal will sink him for sure, and quickly.
>Special Council Smith will SAVE THE DAY!
>The justice system is deliberately slow so as to be thorough and that's okay.

There's only one sure thing which will stop Trump, a super-majority in both houses of congress.

[Walleye]

42. It doesn't matter how many times we beat him. He's not gonna stop running as long as he's alive.$$!

[Major Nikon]

71. I wouldn't expect anything else no matter who was judge

A speedy trial is the right of the accused, not to the prosecution. It wouldn't have been that hard to delay the start of the trial for months even in a relatively straightforward case which this is certainly not.

[docgee]

128. Or a coronary event.

[Historic NY]

2. I hope DOJ gets this changed....

[getagrip_already]

20. how?

Federal judges get broad lattitude to set schedules for their courts. This is in the muddle zone. It isn't eggregious enough to appeal, not that an appeal even for an outrageous date would get anywhere.....

As others have noted, she is going to play this course within the navigational markers, but still land it in tfg's court.

Not much can be done unless she really screws up, and I suspect she has a mentor or three she runs every decision by first, so that ain't gonna happen.

[Deminpenn]

39. Trump's legal calendar is already crowded

The second E. Jean Carrol trial is set for this Oct, the Manhattan DA's trial is set for March 2024, the NY AG's trial is between those two, iirc.

There will be indictments in GA and DC coming along within the next few weeks.

[getagrip_already]

43. don't forget the michael cohen case.....

There are probably others as well.

[BumRushDaShow]

108. As an update - Cohen literally just announced a settlement of his case today

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10143103120

[Polybius]

114. Changed to get moved sooner?

Or later?

[ProudMNDemocrat]

3. With the next round of Federal Indictments coming down.

T2FIFG will be too busy to campaign because he will be tied up with Indictments. Georgia will be big as well, for it is connected to the overall Federal case and possible RICO chsrges as well.

[thesquanderer]

8. Or he will not be too busy to campaign, because he will pretty much ignore the indictments.

I think Trump's "legal strategy" is to ignore it all, become president in January 2025, and then use his position to get everything against him dismissed, one way or another. Whether he could actually succeed at doing this is kind of besides the point. I think in his mind, this is the answer.

[gab13by13]

21. He can't ignore indictments,

when the trial is scheduled he must be present in the court room.

[thesquanderer]

34. He has the right to be there, but as I understand it, he may not be obligated to be there,

at least not for the duration.

[BumRushDaShow]

75. He can't dismiss state investigations or charges

and there are some in NY and GA.

[cstanleytech]

103. Do any of the states recognize Presidential pardons when it comes to crimes at the State level?

[BumRushDaShow]

106. There is no connection between state or federal crimes

although they might be for similar violations.

Except for what happens in D.C. or a territory (not including international crimes), "crimes" will always happen in "a state". But states have their own laws passed by their legislatures and the federal government has laws passed by Congress.

A President cannot pardon a state conviction. Depending on the state, a Governor could pardon for a state conviction (but not a federal one however).

[getagrip_already]

25. he will still have to appear in court for these trials.....

These aren't civil proceding he can just skip at his own peril. He will have to sit there, stony faced and arms crossed, every day the court is in session.

And if the judge allows it, on teevee!

[thesquanderer]

36. I don't think he's necessarily required to be present throughout the trial. n/t

[getagrip_already]

40. I believe a defendent in a federal criminal trial is required to be present.....

They have wheeled people in from the hospital before. They transfer them in from prison.

Only in rare cases, and during covid lockdowns, did they permit a defendent to appear remotely via zoom. But they still had to appear.

[KPN]

90. Who's they? In this case it would be Aileen Cannon, would it not?

[getagrip_already]

95. they being the federal judiciary....

They have a beurocracy much like other large organizations. Rules made up high get sent down to be implemented accross the courts.

Judges have some discretion. Rule 43 was posted above. That is what canon would have to follow. I don't know the rules so I can't say if she could grant an exception, but it wouldn't go un-noticed by the jury, and the prosecution would surely point it out in closing arguments.

The best way to not to have to appear is to not be indicted. Woops, too late.

[GregariousGroundhog]

53. In federal trials, the defendent generally is required to be present

It's laid out in rule 43 of the Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure:
https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/frcrmp/rule_43

New York and Georgia may have different rules about a defendant waiving the right to be present.

[wnylib]

65. NOT on TV. Federal trials are not televised.

[getagrip_already]

67. unless the judge permits it, correct?

Is it a prohibition or a rule the judge can set aside?

[wnylib]

70. No, the judge cannot permit it in a criminall trial. Only in a civil one.

[BComplex]

48. Donald Trump will never again be president.

Ain't gonna happen.

[wnylib]

72. I hope you are right, but there is no guarantee that he won't.

[thesquanderer]

73. But the point is, he believes otherwise. n/t

[MiHale]

100. He believes he's 6'7"....

Weighing in at 184, is handsome, a genius and everyone loves him.

[Escurumbele]

93. I agree with you, I have been saying for a long time.

Yes, the warnings about his criminality and plans to convert the USA in a dictatorship must be told over and over, because those are not trump's ideas only, those are the GOP's ideas. The republican party it is a fully corrupt organization and most of their members are cowards.

[Bayard]

97. Thank you!

He's trailing indictments like Jacob Marley's chains. He's not going anywhere, except prison.

[JHB]

98. Minus the "again", that's what was said in 2016

And the dismissal of the possibility contributed to the "Ain't" happening.

[BComplex]

126. I know, JHB; but a whole lot of water has gone under the bridge since 2016.

He is responsible for a whole lot of Americans growing up (in terms of being a "young country&quot ) really fast. I know he's a horrible threat to our democracy by giving crazy people a platform and a loud voice, but I think a lot of republicans are sick and tired of that crap, and that's why I think Chris Christie is going to be the "dark horse" in this race.

[wnylib]

61. Will he need to campaign?

All he has to do is make some statements about the injustice of a trial during his campaign.

Besides, with the delays that his lawyers will come up with, the trial in the MAL docs case will not begin before the election. Cannon just guaranteed that.

[agingdem]

69. if this doesn't upset Jack Smith then it shouldn't upset us,,

you can bet he anticipated Cannon's Trump ass-crawling accommodation..I suspect this is why he sent a J6 target letter to Trump's attorneys and a not so subtle message to Cannon...you can fuck around with dates and motions but your boy is going down in DC (and maybe New Jersey)..and btw Fani Willis, Alvin Bragg, and Letitia James say "Hi"..

[bluestarone]

4. Well, i guess he NOW has more time to

Go to court on ALL OTHER charges. This fucker should be in PRISON.

[wnylib]

68. He and his lawyers will use the documents trial

as an excuse to delay the other trials.

They will say, "Can't have a J6 trial until after the Florida trial because we need time to go through all the documents and prepare a case."

But, the judge and jurisdiction for J6 will be in DC. Not likely to rule in Trump's favor.

[getagrip_already]

81. Hey judge, October is open......

Seriously, there isnt a lot of pre-trial prep that is required for this trial (yea, we still haven't seen the charges, but...). There aren't any classified docs that we know of. There won't be any untested exec priv claims. Nothing in the evidence that really can be appealed.

Get a reasonably competant judge and this can be hammered out and started in weeks, not months. It could be over and done before the docs case even starts.

[wnylib]

86. You misunderstood what I meant.

I was referring to the Florida trial being used as an excuse to delay other trials. In other words, Trump lawyers would try to delay the J6 trial date by saying that they already have another trial to prepare for (Florida docs case) which requires a lot of time to process the documents involved. Therefore, the J6 trial should be delayed until after the docs trial.

[getagrip_already]

88. No, I understood it.....

And countered that the J6 trial is independent of that and suffers from none of that. The doj could easily argue that the tfg legal team is inflating the amount of work involved in reviewing the evidence in the docs case and can easily prepare for the j6 case in the october/november timefrme.

The doj probably needs no more than 6 weeks to press the j6 case start to finish before a jury. Maybe 6 weeks before. Tfg has more than the means to staff the legal teams for both trials. He had the means to commit the crimes after all.

[BumRushDaShow]

94. "the Florida trial being used as an excuse to delay other trials."

Loose Cannon has no control over anything that happens under D.C. District Judge Beryl Howell's schedules, which would be overseen by the new Chief Judge of the D.C. District - James “Jeb” Boasberg. Howell has been handling the J6 cases.

There’s a new chief judge in DC who could help determine the fate of Donald Trump

By Katelyn Polantz and Tierney Sneed, CNN
Updated 3:56 PM EDT, Fri March 17, 2023

(snip)

Chief Judge Beryl Howell, who has served in that role since 2016, has repeatedly green-lit Justice Department requests to pursue information about Trump’s actions, from his top advisers and lawyers and even inside the White House. She’ll be succeeded by James “Jeb” Boasberg, a fellow Barack Obama appointee and one-time Brett Kavanaugh law school roommate who’s well-known in Washington.

While presiding over the highly secretive Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court in 2020 and 2021, Boasberg encouraged the declassification of information so that the public could read proceedings related to the FBI’s probe into possible collusion between Trump and Russia.

If the Justice Department were to indict Trump, the case would be randomly assigned to one of the district court’s judges, meaning the chief could handle the case but may not. Still, the chief judge has unusual sway over the pace and scope of investigations as the Justice Department attempts to enforce its grand jury subpoenas, obtain warrants and access evidence it has collected by arguing to the chief judge in sealed proceedings.

“This court would be ready,” Howell said in a recent interview with CNN, when asked about the historic possibility of a Trump indictment. She added any judge on that court “would do it justice.”

(snip)

https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/16/politics/chief-judge-howell-boasberg/index.html

[wnylib]

101. Of course Cannon has no control over what happens

in other districts. That is a very obvious given. It also has nothing to do with what I was saying.

I was suggesting that the Trump lawyers might argue before a DC judge that a trial for charges relating to J6 should be delayed until after the Florida trial is completed. The reason they might give is that Trump and his attorneys might say that they need so much time to prepare for the Florida case, due to the numerous documents and security issues, that the J6 trial should be scheduled for AFTER the Florida docs trial.

But, as I said, I don't think that a DC judge will be moved by such an argument.

[BumRushDaShow]

110. 45's lawyers have argued plenty of nonsense to that D.C. court

and have been smacked down every time - including something as serious as the "crime-fraud exception" and "Executive Privilege".

So they would argue to "delay" regardless - even giving the excuse of the state-related trials in NYC and GA. But the chances of "waiting" for the classified docs to be done is probably a non-starter if it can be scheduled and completed fairly quickly.

As it is, we have no idea what the schedule timing will be for this J6 trial given there are dozens of other J6-related charged individuals going through the motions right now (including those choosing to plead guilty and move on without a trial and others doing bench trials, etc). So that D.C. District court has it down pat (the only main difference being a former President is being thrown into the mix).

There has been speculation that the J6 thing might be broken up into separate actions, with certain individuals/groups being charged and tried separately, as well as keeping the option open for superseding indictments at some later date.

[Freethinker65]

5. Insane. There will never be a trial with this judge.

[former9thward]

28. This judge?

Did you have a problem when the prosecution asked for a delay?

[gab13by13]

49. Yes, this judge,

she was admonished by the Appeals court for going beyond her authority in favor of Trump.

[former9thward]

55. Actually she was not "admonished" if you read the decision.

But that aside, district court judges are reversed by appellate courts all the time. What does that have to do with the setting of the trial date in this case?

[Raven123]

6. By that time most primary elections will have been completed

Should be quite a circus


https://www.270towin.com/2024-presidential-election-calendar/

[gab13by13]

18. Trump will have the nomination sewed up by then.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

99. Good.

Am I the only one who wants trump rat-fucking the republicans all the way to the general election?

I get the theory that I could be whistling past the graveyard but there’s no way independents want to elect this clown-show for another go-round.

Incumbent Biden will beat trump like a rug.

[newdayneeded]

134. She'll use that as the reason to drop

Last edited Fri Jul 21, 2023, 07:28 PM - Edit history (1)

all charges and dismiss the case.

[wiggs]

7. Smith may appeal. Doesn't mess around. nt

[former9thward]

31. Appeal what?

Judges have the right to set trial dates. And Smith asked for a delay himself.

[Effete Snob]

92. Even if there was a ground for appeal here, which there is not

Just when do you think the appeal will be heard?

[forthemiddle]

9. I think this is good news

I always thought that an April/May trial would be perfect. That gives the Republicans enough time to nominate him, and if he’s found guilty, not enough time to get a replacement.
This leaves Biden with virtually the entire stage to talk agendas while all the Republicans will be talking about is the “witch hunt.”
If the trial had been any earlier, it would have blown over by then, or given an alternate candidate too much time.
I see this as really good news for Biden.

[gab13by13]

12. I respect your opinion but totally disagree with it.

Trump will have the nomination locked up by then and he will be required to be present in the court room. The MSM will blame Democrats for putting their thumbs on the scale for President Biden.

[JohnSJ]

23. +++. The Georgia, January 6th, and other trials will be held and decided before the documents

trial even starts.

Ironic that the document case is the most straight forward won, and shouldn't take that long.

[gab13by13]

30. I wouldn't take that long with a different judge.

[jimfields33]

51. Another judge would have said no to jack smith asking for a four month delay

She should have told jack no! The trial begins in august 2023.

[getagrip_already]

33. He won't be the nominee untill the convention, no matter how locked up it is......

The gop can always pitch it to someone else for reasons. There are always provisions, in case of death for example, where they can make last minute subsstitutions.

It doesn't really get tricky until they submit names to the states for official entry onto ballots. But even then, they could probably do something.

[Firestorm49]

19. Just curious. Why do you think that Republicans would even look for a replacement?

We know that the ego of the buffoon would not tolerate a replacement candidate - incarcerated or not. He’s the fascists best chance of destroying democracy and most of them overwhelmingly approve of him as their fuhrer. Jailing him would only strengthen their resolve..

There’s only one absolutely sure way to stop him, but I’m not going to suggest it. Others have already done that.

[Polybius]

116. There will be enough time for a replace if he's found guilty before October 1

If he's found guilty much later, than no.

[gab13by13]

10. Just imagine what the right wing narrative will be,

Trump will have the nomination locked up by then. He will be required to be present in the court room I believe, which will be plastered all over the MSM as Democrats putting their thumbs on the scale for President Biden.

[getagrip_already]

35. It will be plastered all over the msm, but what will be plastered is the evidence and narrative ....

Of the crimes committed and the day to day drama of the trial. It happens in every trial. People get caught up in the perry mason flow.

The joe biden hidden hand crap will end as soon as the court convenes and testimony begns. ESPECIALLY if either audio or video is permitted in the non-canon cases.

Once people see the weight of the evidence, and the witness testimony, and te lack of a defense, it will be like the house 1/6 hearings all over again.

[yardwork]

85. The media was going to do that anyway, though.

I don't see this as good for Trump. At the very least, it's a distraction from campaigning, where every day counts. The media may portray him as a victim, but that's not the strategy he won on in 2016. He's supposed to be a strong, heroic bully, kicking ass on behalf of oppressed white people. Having to show up in court over and over makes it look like he's losing, not winning.

I think this will lose him independents and even some hardcore supporters. They might not be moved to bother to vote.

Meanwhile, if Democrats get out the vote...

[Otto_Harper]

11. My one great concern over this timing

is that the MSM will turn coverage of the trial into yet another source of free, lopsided campaign coverage for the lout.

[gab13by13]

14. Absolutely,

Trump will be required to be present in the court room, and every day when the session is over Trump will run to a microphone.

[jaxexpat]

46. The high point of your point is the fact that Trump will have free campaign time on national TeeVee.

If the Republicans were to run another candidate, the noise from Trump's charade would detract from their candidate's chances.

[PSPS]

13. I still think the federal case will disappear

I certainly hope I'm wrong but, with all the delays, it's just a matter of time until the DOJ brings out its pretend "rule" that they won't proceed within X months of an election, where X equals the number of months until the election*

* Applies only to republicans

[gab13by13]

15. It may be postponed until after the election, that is my take.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

16. Breaking: Mar-a-Lago documents case to begin May 20, 2024

Link to tweet

[JohnSJ]

17. I suspect there will be other trials that will be started and even determined before this even

starts.

While the document trial is very straight forward, it is also apparent that the Georgia trial, false electors, etc. seem pretty straight forward also.

[aggiesal]

22. Talk about picking a day between Dec. 2023 and Nov. 2024 ...

Last edited Fri Jul 21, 2023, 11:22 AM - Edit history (1)

She can't appear like she's a Pendejo45 hack so she picked the most neutral ground.

Jack Smith said that the trial should only take 21 days.
I'd love to see Pendejo45 perp walked on/by July the 4th.

[ancianita]

26. "Jack Smith said that the trial should only take 21 days"

When did Jack Smith say this. Link?

[Deminpenn]

32. It was in his court filing

nt

[ancianita]

45. Okay, thank you. I'll check that out.

[Fiendish Thingy]

60. To be clear, Smith meant 21 days after all the preliminary preparations

After all the CIPA and discovery issues were resolved, and after jury selection.

[ancianita]

63. For sure. Thanks.

[jimfields33]

56. Actually the date was august 2023. Jack requested December.

Why did he need a four month delay for a 21 day trial?

[BumRushDaShow]

64. They would have to schedule a courtroom too (plus the judge's schedule)

So some of that is factored in.

[wnylib]

77. But before the actual trial with sworn testimony begins,

there will be days or weeks of jury selection and various determinations on handling the top secret documents with regard to the members of the jury and what they can see. So maybe 5 weeks or more for the trial.

[aggiesal]

80. 5 weeks puts it in early June, 21 days later ...

places it around the end of June, early July.
This, of course, assumes that May 2024 means the first week in May.
If it's the last week in May, then the last week of July.

I still stand by my July the 4th prediction.

Maybe we could set up a pool on the date, and the winner gets to donate their winnings to the candidate(s) of their choice.

[wnylib]

83. The specific date in May has been given. It is May 20, 2024

[aggiesal]

87. Then I pick the date of 7/22/2024 ...

I still think we should create a pool to pick the date that the verdict is announced.
$20 per date.
Put the money in some GoFundMe or an ActBlue account and the winner
gets to choose which candidate(s) get the money.
If nobody gets the correct date, then DU donates it to the candidate(s) of their choice.

[GreenWave]

120. She split it down the middle,

like a skit from ancient SNL where the samurai judge would threaten to split everything done the middle including in custody hearings with his sword,,,

[ancianita]

24. That's no middle ground, imo.

[Aviation Pro]

27. Keep putting your finger on that scale of justice Loose Banana Cannon

Bloated Tick will be convicted in DC and Atlanta long before this trial reaches your out-of-your-depth court.

Oh, Killa Jack is prepared to deal with you, lightweight.

[Deminpenn]

29. Trump's lawyers must be apoplectic

This is a terrible date for him. If, as the special prosecutor said, the trial will take approximately 21 days, that puts it into June (and only weeks after Bragg's trial). The Republican National Convention is in mid-July.

The legal beagles on MSNBC were expecting a March date, but that conflicts with the trial date in NYC.

Cannon said the 2024 election calendar wasn't going to be part of her consideration and it appears it wasn't.

I expect the J6th indictment trial date to be set before the case in FL.

[SergeStorms]

38. They'll delay this past the 2024 election.

Trump, and his council, must be ecstatic about this. 😡

No way this trial even begins before the 2024 election. Cannon sends another big, sloppy, wet kiss to her benefactor. 😠

[BumRushDaShow]

44. The South Florida Circuit is the "Rocket Docket" and this flies in the face of that

so it leaves a lot to be desired regarding whether that stands or not.

[Deminpenn]

57. Except this trial isn't happening in a vacuum

Trump's got a the NY AG civil trial set for Oct 2nd this year. The second E. Jean Carroll trial is set for January 2024. Granted he doesn't have to appear in person for either of these, but his lawyers do.

The Manhattan DA's trial date is March 2024 and Trump will have to be in court for that.

November and December are both impacted by the general holiday time off everyone wants to take between Thanksgiving and Christmas.

[BumRushDaShow]

62. Oh I know about all the trials

and that is something that has been discussed at length among the legal contributors on MSNBC.

But these trials are not going to be months long either. If anything, the classified documents one IS trickier due to the nature of the materials being litigated, the special handling of docs, and getting the clearances, etc. However a "May 20" date is also a week before a holiday (Memorial Day is May 27, 2024), so one can make excuses about "holidays" but those occur year round.

[onenote]

118. Not every case warrants "rocket docket" treatment

And this case clearly is more complex, particularly given the CIPA component and the volume of discovery, than the typical Southern District of Florida criminal case.

For the year ended March 31, 2023, the median length of time from filing to disposition of felony cases in the Southern District was 9 months. I believe that includes cases disposed of by a plea bargain. Which means as many cases take more than 9 months than take less than 9 months.

[BumRushDaShow]

122. I get that and mentioned in the post just above

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=3103034

But the idea is that even with scheduling that date, it still obviously leaves open the potential of other delays before even reaching it (from either side) and the length of those further delays, would I think, or at least SHOULD be reigned in more strongly there than in than other places... we hope.

[Deminpenn]

47. I have to disagree

Judge Cannon controls the calendar for motions. She's already set aggressive deadlines for security clearances, etc. Trump does have other court dates already scheduled, too.

Smith asked for an unusually short window for the trial date. Most of the lawyers I've seen on cable have said for national security trials having to use the classified documents procedure, the timeline is about 8 months which would be Jan/Feb 2024.

[gab13by13]

52. So much for the 70 day Rocket Docket law.

[onenote]

121. You clearly don't understand the Speedy Trial Act.

I suggest you read up on it before posting.

PS -- There is no "Rocket Docket" law.

[ancianita]

59. Thanks. You've convinced me.

Though this decision doesn't yet make her a trustworthy judge.

[RedSpartan]

41. To quote Senator Sheev Palpatine:

[Fiendish Thingy]

50. Perfect timing

That will give Smith enough time to convict him on his J6 charges in DC, and Willis to convict him in GA.

By next May, he will no longer be The Defendant, he will be The Convicted Felon.

What started out as an appetizer will end up being dessert…just desserts.

[gab13by13]

54. I like your optimism.

[ancianita]

66. Yep.

I'll take it. And the way you're considering the timeline.

[sybylla]

91. Yep, it also give all the magats plenty of time to make him their candidate, too.

Then we'll get the popcorn out for the complete chaos at the GQP convention.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

113. Brava!

[sarcasmo]

58. Slow walking the Rocket Docket.

[peppertree]

123. +1

Aileen, she wants her Mercedes.

[onenote]

133. Not sure what you think the 'rocket docket' is.

But its not some hard and fast schedule for resolving criminal cases, particularly complex cases with several dozen charges, two defendants, and a lot of witnesses and discovery.

For the year ending March 31, 2023, the MEDIAN length of time for a felony case heard in the Southern District of Florida, from indictment to disposition, was 9 months. And that includes a lot of very simple cases.

[mahatmakanejeeves]

74. "May 2024 is a very reasonable, perhaps a bit fast, trial date for Trump's case."

May 2024 is a very reasonable, perhaps a bit fast, trial date for Trump’s case. Don’t let people who don’t know what they are talking about tell you otherwise.

[BumRushDaShow]

76. Good to see Popehat move to Mastodon!

[mahatmakanejeeves]

79. He's been there several months.

And good morning. I think I'm going to check out from work early today.

[BumRushDaShow]

89. Good morning (in the 4 minutes left of it that there is) to you!

TGIF and supposed to be a nice weekend for a change - at least up here!

[muriel_volestrangler]

107. Thanks - a professional lawyer opinion is good to know on this (nt)

[lark]

82. Traitor Cannon gets started on her destroy America tour.

Worse is to come when she sides with tfg over client/attorney privilege. Watch!

[3825-87867]

84. How important will be trump's VP selection?

Should trump get the Repub Nomination, go to trial in May, drag it out til just after the election and, universe forbid, be elected, then as a convicted felon no longer be able to hold office, will his VP choice become president?

Legally if convicted before he becomes pres in 2025, he still can't do squat to pardon himself. But his VP...MTG...after inauguration, pres by succession or rather in her words, "appointment?"


Just curious.

[drray23]

105. there is nothing in the constitution that says you cant hold office as a convicted felon

That is not part of the requirements to be president.

[BumRushDaShow]

119. "there is nothing in the constitution that says you cant hold office as a convicted felon"

14th Amendment

Amendment XIV

(snip)

Section 3.

No person shall, be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any state, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any state legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any state, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

(snip)

https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/amendmentxiv

(you may have heard this section brought up by pundits which is why they are hoping some of the charges touch on this)

[Fresh Water Falling]

96. Unsurprising

The Cannon Who Never Shoots Straight will do anything to protect the Orange Crash from facing consequences. There really ought to be some method of getting I Lean Fascist off the case!

[Oopsie Daisy]

102. Moving the documents case to the back-burner will give Smith with an advantage in the Jan-6 case.

That one, and the Georgia case, will be the ones that send Trump to prison.

[ECL213]

104. Why is the handling of classified documents during the trial so difficult that it requires delay?

If the f'ing data is so G.D. classified and sensitive that it can't be disclosed to the jury, and Donnie Dumbfuck was hoarding, hiding, sharing and refusing to return the data, case f'ing closed.

The jury doesn't need to know exactly what was in the documents, the jury just needs to know 1) many of the documents are classified, 2) the document was in dickwad's possession, 3) dickwad showed the document to someone, 4) dickwad refused to return the documents, 5) dickwad purposely concealed or ordered people to conceal the documents.

None of that needs to be slow-rolled.

[onenote]

117. Not a lawyer, I take it.

Not familiar with the law. With due process. The presumption of innocence. The burden of proof.

Pretty much everything you wrote is wrong.

[ECL213]

124. Actually I am, though I do not practice criminal law...

Former Federal Prosecutor Robert Mintz had this to say:

"So in a very real sense, this indictment that former President Trump is facing is not about what documents he took with him when he left the White House. It's all about what he's alleged to have done after the government requested the return of those documents."

So, please do go on and tell me how much smarter you are than I am.

[onenote]

125. Of course it is about the documents.

If it wasn't about the documents, why did Smith file a 19 page discussion of CIPA and how it relates to this case. Among other things, it acknowledges that the burden is on the government must prove as an element of the crime charged that certain material relates to the national defense or constitutes classified information and that CIPA requires the government to inform the defendant of which portions of the material it reasonably expects to rely upon to prove the national defense or classified information element of the crime.

Put another way, the "delay" issue isn't about the jury's access to the substance of the documents -- although that can be an issue in the trial. It is about the disclosure of confidential information to the defense, who can be expected to argue with respect to each document cited in the indictment, that such document does not meet the standard set forth therein-- i.e., whether the document is one "relating to the national defense, or information relating to the national defense which information the possessor has reason to believe could be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of any foreign nation."

In order to be in a position to challenge the indictment on that element, they have to have access to the document or a summary of it. That triggers CIPA and the delays inherent in CIPA.


In short, it is not a question of whether I'm smarter than you -- it's simply that I take Smith at his word when he discusses, at length, the myriad rights and obligations of the prosecution and defense in a case brought under 18 USC 793 (e ). In that regard, I'd be interested in the context in which Mintz made the statement cited in your post.

https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/23861393/govuscourtsflsd648653320.pdf

[ECL213]

127. Smith is the one who asked for the December trial date.

So, please do take him at his word. He thought that was plenty of time.

[onenote]

131. As you acknowledge, even Smith recognized the need to give the defense time to prepare

Your post wasn't about the amount of time the defense needs to prepare. It was about the jury's access to the documents. Smith doesn't contest that the case can't be decided without some way of the defense presenting and the jury deciding the issue of whether the documents meet the 18 USC 793 standard. He proposed December. My guess is that he knew that would be pushed out and it was only a question of how long.

[ECL213]

135. Hey, great guess.

[republianmushroom]

109. I don't think that the trail will ever happen. The play book "delay" and a judge to help.

30 months and counting

Now a year from indictment time. Good luck. with having this go to trial.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

111. Thank you

for this info.

I'm just curious what trial date would have satisfied the naysayers?

No...let me guess...3 years ago.

[SergeStorms]

129. Jack Smith requested a December start.

Trump's guardian, Cannon, believes 6 months past that date is fair.

Justice delayed is justice denied.

[llashram]

112. this trial date

is 8 months from now and 5+ months before the general election. Seems a long time to start the document trial. So I hope the J6 trial and/or Fulton County Fani Willis trial will trip this slippery snake up. Because as a layman out here, I feel something is amiss and I am failing to understand it.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

115. Tough luck Donny boy

[Marthe48]

130. Once he's charged and trial is set

statute of limitations won't run out, will it?

[The Grand Illuminist]

132. Charges were brought too early.

Now the trial(s) will happen before elections which may hurt us badly in the long run.