My thought about Zohran Mamdani and the Democratic Party.

[MIButterfly]

My opinion and nobody has to agree with it, but here's what I think. The people of New York City chose Zohran Mamdani to be their candidate for mayor and the Democratic Party should, to a person, back the one CHOSEN BY THE PEOPLE for the general election. That's who they want. It shouldn't be who the establishment wants it to be or who they think it should be or whose turn it is; let the PEOPLE decide and then back whoever they choose. It may be a simple solution and maybe I'm simple, but that's how I see it.

This nitpicking between the factions in the Democratic Party has not gotten us anywhere and I don't understand why the Powers That Be continue to do it. United we stand and all that. Let's fight the Republicans, not each other.

[mr715]

1. Yeah.

Run in a Democratic primary and win, you get Democratic support.

Run and lose, you don't get that.

[Emile]

2. "We have a Democratic nominee. Are we a party who rallies behind our nominee or not?,"

AOC

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

58. YES!

[Lovie777]

3. Unfortunately and some times it's wrong, but Democrats do have different opinions especially .......

about candidates. Cuomo is well known, his father was a prominent Democrat I believe the Governor of New York as well. Heck, Cuomo helped me through COVID, every morning I would tune in to hear him give status and information concerning NYC.

I'm from California, and that said, I do have respect for him, and I realized he may have crossed over to the dark side.

I do support Mamdani.

[Scrivener7]

5. I am with you. Cuomo's term, like Bloomberg's had much that was awful in it, and much that

was very welcomed. He kept me sane, too, when the sirens were running all night long here and the big tent hospital in the local mall parking lot was full. It was terrifying, and even knowing the bad things he did, I will always be grateful for that. And I don't think Cankles would dare to put military on the streets of NYC if he was the mayor.

BUT the people have spoken. Democrats have chosen Mamdani. Backing anyone but Mamdani is nothing but rank disrespect for New York's voters.

NO Democrat, when asked, should be giving ANYTHING but full-throated support to Mamdani. This avoidance disrespects all Democratic constituents.

[msongs]

24. there is always the least bad choice . just be grateful for any vote he gets no matter how begrudging

[sdfernando]

4. It really is that simple.

Granted, I don't follow New York City politics and I am not very familiar with Zohran Mamdani....but the people have spoken....you know, the people in "WE THE PEOPLE". If we are going to have political parties, then once a candidate is chosen during a primary, every single person in that party, to a tee, should be working 100% get get that nominee elected....FULL STOP!

Not doing this is what is causing democratic voter registrations to decline. If the people don't feel their voice is heard and listened to, they will go somewhere else to be heard, or just entirely pull back. Either of those is not a good thing.

[newdeal2]

6. I don't think endorsements should be automatic

If that’s what you mean by back him.

If you endorse someone, it should authentic and done enthusiastically. You’re putting your name and reputation on the line so you better be damn sure.

[MIButterfly]

9. How about, if you can't, in good conscience, endorse the candidate, then don't say anything?

I've voted for Democratic candidates in the general election that I didn't vote for in the primary because, like my mother always said, the worst Democrat is better than the best Republican and that's never been truer than it is now.

[WarGamer]

7. I'm not a New Yorker... the people will make the final decision, soon.

[SocialDemocrat61]

8. What exactly is the "establishment" doing to harm Mamdani?

Is the DNC withholding funding and data that he is entitled to? Are any major democrats working to elect one of his opponents? If you’re talking about endorsements, it should be noted in 24 that Hochal and Schumer didn’t endorse Adams until late October, the weekend before the election. Other Democrats such as Gillibrand and Booker didn’t make any endorsement 4 years ago. Most likely because they don’t live in New York. Plus members of the same party endorsing each other is just political incest anyway.

[mr715]

10. Mamdani is not taking any harm

The establishment is harming itself.

[SocialDemocrat61]

12. How?

What actions have they taken? Please be specific?

[mr715]

14. I'll do my best, I'll try to be logical.

I think Mamdani is extremely likely to win, and that his electoral success is the result of an energetic style of campaign and policies that are popular (and will work). The policies he communicates are simple, straightforward, and relatable to the majority of NYers.

To your question of what actions have "they" (leadership) taken - it is that they have not endorsed and allowed the cultivation of a narrative that the politics Mamdani advocates are way out there. Free buses, amirite?

It boils down to Jeffries, a NYer in leadership has not endorsed. Gillibrand levied some pretty Islamophobic attacks and yes, apologized, but that she went there in the first place provides fuel for the GOP to conflate good governance with extremist policy.

I think that in their failure to recognize Mamdani's success and cultivate the energy he is bringing, they are showing themselves (again, the establishment is hurting themselves) to be unwilling to adapt to new models of politics. This is problematic because the narrative of them being out of touch and disconnected from the people that invest in them the authority to govern is already there, and this reinforces it. It, at least to me, has a tang of cowardice and I find distasteful.

I will admit to you to be completely transparent: Cuomo lost me. Mamdani won me.

My hope is that this at least clarifies my thinking, even if it isn't clear. Apologies for having a mind as clear as mud.

[SocialDemocrat61]

15. Most endorsements in 21

Didn’t come until the end of October. And endorsements are bs anyway. But are there any substantial actions that the “establishment” has taken against Mamdani?

[mr715]

16. How about Cuomo?

He is pretty establishment.

[SocialDemocrat61]

18. F*ck Cuomo

He’s not “establishment” Are any of the “establishment” democrats supporting him?

[mr715]

19. Ha!

I greatly appreciate this reply lol

I don't know.

[SocialDemocrat61]

21. Then what is the "establishment" doing?

Are the national or state party organizations withholding data or funding that the Mamdani campaign is entitled to?

[mr715]

23. You say fuck Cuomo

I say he is part of the establishment. As I said before, I think this is less of an active harm thing than a demonstration of feckless leadership.

[SocialDemocrat61]

27. Cuomo is not part of the establishment

He holds no office and isn't a member of the DNC. And the only fecklessness here is criticism of the "establishment" without being able to state one actual action taken against Mamdani.

[mr715]

30. I've done my best to articulate my reasoning.

I don't know why we have to tie ourselves in knots to support the Democratic nominee.

Let's not talk in circles - I think we both know where we stand here.

[SocialDemocrat61]

36. And I've asked you to cite

actual actions that have been taken against Mamdani. Any else is just spin and grievance shopping.

[thesquanderer]

62. Cuomo was establishment Democrat until he declared himself himself IND after losing the Dem primary.

Last edited Mon Sep 29, 2025, 11:07 PM - Edit history (1)

And it's one thing not to endorse the person who beat you (or at least not right away), but another thing entirely to actually run against him. Some states actually have laws against that. Whether you agree with those laws or not, this behavior is not good for the party, especially from someone who was not on the fringe of the party to begin with, but was practically the definition of party establishment, which Cuomo was. Even with the scandals that brought him down, he was still pretty much the poster boy for New York Democrat over his career, and presented himself as Dem right up until he lost to Mamdami.

Adams didn't have Cuomo's long and high profile career, but nonetheless, as mayor of NYC, he was NY Dem establishment until he, too, went independent after declining to run in the Dem primary after determining that he could not win it.

Interesting contrast referenced here, about how the biggest national establishment Dems Pelosi and Biden welcomed Adams 4 years ago, and now even establishment Dems from his own home state (Schumer and Jeffries) are keeping him at arm's length:

https://www.axios.com/2025/07/21/zohran-mamdani-new-york-democrats-wary

And since you wanted examples, besides those, the New York State Democratic Chair (Jay Jacobs) has refused to endorse him.

[SocialDemocrat61]

64. Cuomo sucks

I completely agree. But he hasn’t been been part of the “establishment” since he resigned as Governor in disgrace.

You’re right about Jacobs, as chair of the state party, he should endorse the nominee, although I doubt his endorsement would change a single vote.

But my question was what actions has the “establishment” taken against Mamdani? Has party funds or voter.data been withheld from him?

[thesquanderer]

67. While they may not be withholding funds, I doubt the party machinery under Jacobs is working to elect him, either.

Fundraising, GOTV, etc.... How can you inspire your organization to work to elect someone you refuse to endorse? It's not just damaging if the party takes actions against him, as you suggest. It's also damaging if the party does not take action to support him.

[SocialDemocrat61]

68. That's supposition

And as a life long new Yorker, the state party doesn't get involved in NYC campaigns other than providing some funding and data. They don't bus people down from upstairs new York to work in city campaigns.

[Tribetime]

81. I still think he's part of the establishment since he didn't resign and disappear

[SocialDemocrat61]

83. That's an opinion

And it doesn't reflect reality. He holds no post in the party on either a state or national level. So is anyone who has ever been elected to office as a democrat automatically a member of the "establishment"? If so that means Mamdani who is an elected democratic assemblyman is establishment too.

[Emile]

20. Excellent reply! I believe this is a leadership test.

[SocialDemocrat61]

22. No, it's a purity test.

And that’s the last thing democrats need right now. Purity tests didn’t serve democrats well in 2000, 04, 16 or 24.

[mr715]

25. Who is looking for purity?

I am not. But my lying eyes tell me that Mamdani has stumbled on a campaign that others could learn from.

[SocialDemocrat61]

29. Sure they could

But that's not the issue
The issue is the unsupported accusations that the "establishment" is taking actions against Mamdani.

[mr715]

33. What is your definition of establishment? nt

[SocialDemocrat61]

37. National and state party officials

and elected office holders. Not a disgraced former governor who was forced to resign and is now running as an independent.

[mr715]

38. It isn't just me.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/16/zohran-mamdani-democrat-endorsements-kathy-hochul

[SocialDemocrat61]

42. Again I couldn't care less

about endorsements. They are nothing but political incest. I never heard of anyone who based their vote on an endorsement
I've asked several to cite actual actions taken by the "establishment" against Mamdani and haven't heard a single one.

[thesquanderer]

63. Even if endorsements are not important...

...having major party figures not only fail to endorse you, but actually work *against* you, is damaging to the party. As I said in the other post, it's not just that NY Dem establishment figures Cuomo and Adams didn't endorse him when he won, but actually chose to leave the party and run against him and put lots of time and money (esp. Cuomo) into telling New Yorkers how terrible Mamdani is, is definietly an action against him by someone the NY public still sees very much as an establishment Democratic figure (even if you do not).

And the New York State party leader making a point of not endorsing him was significant as well. I agree, that endorsement wouldn't have meant anything. Even if endorsements mattered (I agree, generally debatable), everyone expects the party leader to endorse their candidate. But in this case his specific NON-endorsement also telegraphs what the NY Democratic establishment thinks of Mamdami.

[SocialDemocrat61]

65. Endorsements are bs

In 21 most of the few that happened didn’t until late October. And the only major party figures were ones from NYC. Cuomo hasn’t been “establishment” for years. Adams didn’t run in the primary so it’s not fair to say he was “establishment” too. As far as the NYS chair not endorsing Mamdani, that is wrong. But that’s only one person. And other than the endorsement has he taken any other action against the Mamdani campaign?

[betsuni]

74. Populists use the label Establishment to identify and demonize imaginary corrupt enemies out to get them.

Endorsements are a purity test, those who fail are part of the evil Establishment plotting and rigging to stop progress. How Planned Parenthood ended up on the Establishment enemies list about ten years ago.

Evidently endorsements are so tremendously morally important that Democratic voters carefully keep track and flee the party, disgusted, if an endorsement is not made promptly enough in one mayoral election somewhere in the United States.

[Emile]

40. Are we a party who rallies behind our nominee or not?

[SocialDemocrat61]

43. We should be

But not every democrat rallied around Harris last year, and some worked against Biden after he won the primaries and many democrats worked against Clinton in 16 despite her being the nominee.
But we don't live in a perfect world. And I don't think democrats should require the same kind of fealty that Republicans do. As long as no one takes actual action against Mamdani, I don't have a problem.

[Emile]

44. As I said, it's a leadership test!

[SocialDemocrat61]

45. And as I said

is it's a purity test. Democrats only hurt themselves with those.

[3Hotdogs]

46. Gillibrand lives in N.Y. Booker does not. There is no reason for Booker to endorse candidates for another state.

Mandami is a Socialist Democrat. Bernie is a Democratic Socialist. I don't know what the difference is.

What I do know - Bernie and A.O.C. fill auditoriums.

I live in N.J. I attended. a presentation by Booker before he became mayor of N.J. It was an excellent speech to police officers about their contribution to society. Still, I wouldn't feel inspired to walk across the street to hear another speech by Booker. I will vote for him again, against a Republican, but that is the limit of my support for him.

Now back to Mamdani. The Dem "establishment" is afraid of being associated with the term, socialist. Instead of attacking the issue, they explain that the Democratic Party is not socialist and doesn't believe in socialism.

What they should be doing, is explaining what socialism can offer that would benefit all of us. They should define fascism and point out the characteristics of Republican leadership that are fascist.

Instead, we get ambiguous platform statements that end up in the bottom of the bird cage of those of us who still get newspapers.

--- and we will continue to lose elections.


Carry on.

P.S. I would drive hours to hear Bernie and/or A.O.C.

Oh. And I'm 83 years old.

[SocialDemocrat61]

48. Gillibrand lives in upstate New York

not in NYC. She has never endorsed a candidate for NYC Mayor before. And yes Booker is in another state but has gotten criticized for not endorsing Mamdani.

And you're entitled to your opinion of what you think the "establishment" should be doing. But my question was what actions has the "establishment" taken against Mamdani. Can you cite any?

[3Hotdogs]

49. Moynihan had a term, "Benign neglect."

Oh, and it's kind of you to allow me my opinion. I'll remember to send you a Valentine's heart.

[SocialDemocrat61]

52. Yes he did

but that was about poor communities, not about elections so it really doesn't apply. My question was if there were any actions that the "establishment" has taken against Mamdani? I lived in NYC all my life and I've never seen the national party get involved in local elections. Or so many suddenly requiring that they should.
And you're welcome. Looking forward to the heart. ❤️

[3Hotdogs]

54. gotta wait 'till February fund raiser.

[SocialDemocrat61]

56. Well I'll still give a heart now ❤️

[mr715]

57. Now I want a heart. nt

[SocialDemocrat61]

59. Ok here you go ❤️

But if you want anything more, you'll have to buy me dinner first 😉

[mr715]

60. Just a respectful, thought provoking discussion. And a heart. NT

[sheshe2]

11. I am not a New Yorker and have no ball in this game.

I don't understand all the angst about who endorses whom. He is a candidate for NYC alone. I doubt most would be able to even name the mayor of their own State Capital.

Sure, he was chosen by the people, the people of NYC. Let's let them decide.

[SocialDemocrat61]

17. It's a purity test

to demonize certain democrats.

[sheshe2]

28. You are correct.

[SocialDemocrat61]

34. I've asked for

actual action that has been taken against Mamdani and all I'm getting is double talk.

[Violet_Crumble]

66. Why is anyone obligated to answer questions you ask?

Or do you apply a different standard to yourself? You told me I was free to ask questions, but you had no obligation to answer them.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=20614079

I have no feelings about local elections in the US, apart from hoping the Democratic candidate wins, but if you think what yr getting from other DUers is 'double talk', then that's likely a you problem, as I can't see any double talk. I can see people saying things you clearly don't agree with, however.

[SocialDemocrat61]

69. They are not

But they are responding yet not answering my question. And most of the responses are double talk based on opinions not on facts.

[betsuni]

75. Conspiracy theory that Democrats are corrupted by donors, oligarchs, billionaires, corporations, lobbyists,

Satan, whatever the cat dragged in as long as they have ten dollars or so, and do nothing but plot and rig against the nice pure incorruptibles is taken as so obvious and everybody knows that it need not be explained or any evidence given.

[tritsofme]

13. I'm not from New York, I simply don't care about this election.

I barely care about Chicago’s mayoral elections, and I live 30 minutes away, why would I give two shits about New York?

[mr715]

26. We're the greatest city in the world

Last edited Mon Sep 29, 2025, 09:52 PM - Edit history (1)

And while our pizzas aren't as deep as Chicago's, they are much more portable.

[applegrove]

31. Also a strong democratic socialist movement may convince

Last edited Mon Sep 29, 2025, 09:57 PM - Edit history (3)

oligarchs and the GOP to temper their policy platform. That is what happened to Canada and the US in the 1930s. Socialism was a threat so the capitalists, kick and screaming, had to move to the center. That is why Trump is going so strongly after Mamdani.

[Glen Livid]

32. Either way the Democrat Party wins

If Mamdani wins, it will be a great opportunity to see how his energy transforms the party. If the establishment Powers That Be get behind a candidate chosen by the people, it is an opportunity to move forward. If the establishment does not support the will of the people, they become the Powers That Had Been.

[BWdem4life]

41. Democratic not Democrat. nt

[aeromanKC]

35. George Carlin has already told us why.

And you (we the people) aren't in it.

[Chicagogrl1]

39. We need to support the new guard

What worked in the past is no longer working. We need candidates that are young, articulate, not afraid to fight while hammering home their viewpoints using Tiktok. We need to capture the younger generation. We’ve got to rewrite the DNC playbook and support candidates that are supported by the people. In my opinion, as a direct response to the current wanna be facists, there’s no such thing as too far to the left.

[LilElf70]

51. Amen

I totally agree.

Now we need to find 90 million people that think you are 100% right. Let's take it one step further. What the hell is so bad about free tuition? Medicare PLUS for all?

[sheshe2]

53. "We need to support the new guard"

"We need candidates that are young, articulate, not afraid to fight....the new guard, young and articulate."

What is the new guard?

I am curious, at what age do we start the purge? At what age are they to old and inarticulate? When do we decide they are old and in the way.

[SocialDemocrat61]

55. In the movie Logan"s Run

everyone over 30 was killed. But that may be too young. Maybe 50? Poor Bernie Sanders 😢.

[sheshe2]

61. Dayum, fifty could be the new old and in the way.

Oh no, AOC only has 14 years left and I will weep if Bern is tossed. Oh, wait he won and will be in office until 89.

[betsuni]

79. Then "new guard" gets same "disappointment" complaints, into the Status Quo Establishment binder they go.

It's "All About Eve," someone younger and outsider anti-establishment without a history so everyone can project whatever they want right behind you.

[pat_k]

47. Herding Democrats can be harder than herding cats.

An end to the tendency to jump into circular firing squads would sure be nice, but I fear that such "arguments in the family" are a natural part of being a member of a very diverse party.

That said, I've actually been quite pleased that we are seeing an unusual level of unity in meeting the challenge of opposing the 47 regime. And while I'd love for the entire party to follow the sort of rule we have here (fight it out all you want in primary season, but come together behind the nominee), we don't have any party "enforcers." And I am very, very grateful we don't.

[Cirsium]

50. Well said

Agree 100%.

[thesquanderer]

70. re: " It shouldn't be who the establishment wants it to be or who they think it should be or whose turn it is"

Agreed. I think this bit us in the primaries in 2016 when the Dem establishment put its hand on the scale for Hillary over Bernie, and I'd even argue it bit us again in 2020. Yes, we won, but considering how the term ended and what it led to, it was arguably a pyrrhic victory.

I don't know if Sanders (our runner-up for the nomination both times) would have done better, but he couldn't have done much worse (certainly in 2016). I don't know that our nominee would have been Bernie if it weren't Biden in 2020, but whoever it was, it wouldn't have been Biden if the establishment wasn't pulling for him. Heck, his campaign was going nowhere until Clyburn got him SC. Whether you were a Biden fan or not, in the end, his presidency backfired on us, bigly. Despite its successes.

I live in the NY area, but not in the city, so I didn't have a horse in that primary race. I don't know that I would have voted for Mamdami (I only know I would not have voted for Cuomo). But the people have spoken, and I think the party establishment needs to get over its fear of giving the voters what they want. I at least think it's worth giving that approach a shot. You never know, it might work.

[LyfeTimeDem]

71. He should become a Democrat

Everyone that runs on the Democratic Ticket should BE a Democrat.

[SocialDemocrat61]

72. Mamdani is a democrat

Has been one for years

[LyfeTimeDem]

73. he is a self-identified Socialist

Someone who chose the moniker SocialDemocrat

Should understand the difference between a Democratic (adjective) Socialist (noun) and a Social(adjective) Democrat(noun)

According to Oxford:

Socialism:
An economic system in which the means of production are controlled by the state. Also known as socialist economy. Contrast capitalism. See also marxism.

Aka.... it's an economic system that opposes the private ownership of the means of production also known as Capitalism

We Democrats invented Regulated Capitalism starting with FDR, Social Democracies emulated that success ...including the Nordic ones

Social as an adjective doesnt mean the same when it is a noun...

Social Media
Social Personality
Social Club
Social Worker
Social Studies.

[SocialDemocrat61]

80. He's a member of the Democratic Party

Not the socialist party, if there is one. Anything else is just a label about ideology.

[IbogaProject]

76. Yep Coumo & Adams shouldnt be running

Unless we go jungle primary like California there shouldn't be extra Dems in the race. Coumo had neen allied with the turncoat IDC who ran as D but caucused with the GOP in the NY State Senate so his party loyalty has been weak for awhile.

[bob4460]

77. The old Democrats have to step aside

Or watch our party continue to lose! And I am a old fart but they need to pass the torch!

[SocialDemocrat61]

85. How do you define old?

Sanders is in his 80s. I wouldn’t want him to step aside.

[MichMan]

86. Sanders doesn't identify as a Democrat n/t

[SocialDemocrat61]

87. True

But what about Elizabeth Warren? She's 76. Should she step aside from someone younger?

[Emile]

84. He is a Democrat. It's time to show support for the democratic nominee.