General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsI respectfully disagree with some here in reference to mass shootings...
These RW politicians and zealots do not want this to go away. Yes, it is true that they release as little information as possible, and state and restate the same trivial platitudes and cliches over and over and over again, and all the rest of their illogical bullshit. In a normal situation, this all might be construed as a matter of covering up the situation, and trying to escape from it.
But having watched their behavior for what seems like decades now, I think that these people want this stuff to happen. It keeps people afraid, cowed, paranoid, scared to death, and supportive of a militarized police force. It makes people prone to elect hard-core RW politicians, who are publicly stating that they are for gun rights for the average citizen in order for them to protect themselves from criminals, for the death penalty, particularly for minority offenders, and it lends itself to wishful thinking, which would tend to call for a repressive, aggressive police presence in every facet of the society.
We saw this after 9/11: a diverse majority of the populace favored removing constitutional rights from suspects in order to ostensibly promote the safety of the masses. I had chronicled here over the years, otherwise right-thinking people who went off the rails and advocated for a police state rather than a democratic one. People were seeing terrorists working at the 7-Eleven, ringing up their coffee and Slim Jims.
Nearly everyone I speak to voices fear and concerns about going out of the house, about sending their kids to school, about going shopping, about self-service gas stations, about every action which used to be routine. We live in abject fear of crime, which is best exemplified from a Commercial and publicity viewpoint and basis as mass shootings, which certainly get everyones attention, and is another nail in the coffin of the sanctity of our right to pursue happiness.
Rather than say that these people are covering this up, I would state that this is part of their plan which will enable them to pass laws which repress our behavior , whether it be our voting behaviors and right-to-vote, have school selection and curriculum selection behavior, our right to protest behavior, and eventually choice of religion and which books we can read. In fact, they have already begun work with fruitful results on several I mentioned, as well as of course, the limitations upon pregnancy termination, and very soon, all forms of contraception . They are working very hard at this, and we calmly sit back and say to ourselves well they certainly wouldnt do blah blah blah but make no mistake about it, they will. You can bet the house on it. Theyre well on their way and their dreams are vivid and boundless.

Cracklin Charlie
(12,904 posts)Why else would they want to sell so many weapons?
Its not all about kickbacks.
leftstreet
(37,519 posts)very good points
RKP5637
(67,112 posts)calimary
(88,044 posts)Explains a lot. Their ONE goal and motivation is power. Power in THEIR hands alone, and power to enable THEIR domination of the rest of us.
Because the rest of us are a large, unruly group thats difficult to corral and contain. And theyre hellbent on trying to corral, contain, AND confine if needed. Thats their key to total suppression and control.
usonian
(21,321 posts)Isn't it time that it be used to actually protect Americans rather than demolish their rights?
I trust Joe Biden to choose wisely.
50 Shades Of Blue
(11,276 posts)grumpyduck
(6,670 posts)Too many hints to ignore.
And those pricks don't care how many people die in the process.
WmChris
(419 posts)Whatever the reason for the abhorrent behavior of the GQP. We need to get out the vote and put an end to Reich wing authoritarianism.
wnylib
(25,338 posts)to vote against the Republican gun promoters.
So, besides getting out the vote, we need to out the message that a vote for a Republican is a vote for the next mass shooting.

sanatanadharma
(4,074 posts)To the extent that the 'powers that be' are arming the people, it is obvious that the people wielding the power are not concerned by, not expecting, and therefore certainly not defending against an uprising of the armed populace of 2nd-A militias against overarching government.
wnylib
(25,338 posts)MadameButterfly
(3,622 posts)They believe if they can't win elections they can win it with guns. Only one side is armed. Police and military are heavily Republican. One Republican president and the generals won't be following the constitution either.
We have to stop imagining that the system will protect us. We have to take action while we still have a democracy: Pack the courts so we can restore voting rights and end gerrymandering, add DC and Puerto Rico as states, and end the Electoral College with enough states to pledge to commit delegates to the popular vote (which might be possible with 2 more states). If we don't win 2024 presidency and Congress, AND act radically it will be too late.
wnylib
(25,338 posts)they require a large enough majority in Congress to carry them out. So our priority is to hold the White House and gain control of Congress. It can be done but will take a lot of work.
MadameButterfly
(3,622 posts)We have to be preparing for the lengths that they will go. We can't expect to win with the system stacked against us, we need to restore majority rule
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)around the nation and blocked gun controls large majorities of the people, including on the right, want. WHILE spreading hate, fear and massive grievance among those vulnerable.
Not addressed as much as hate speech is the spread of "fear speech," telling people others plan to hurt them, to incite preemptive violence -- or in our case voting for authoritarian government to "restore law and order." Today's NYT has a piece about "fear speech." They're creating perception of "need" by inciting widespread civil violence.
These are all also standard, proven means of persuading people to vote away their own rights and freedoms in return for promises of safety. Some people right here on DU are anxiously insisting no one's safe anywhere. Their counterparts on RW social media know we're the killers.
Any POTUS the MAGAs are likely to accept would soothe their fears by promising to put the National Guard and police on the streets with orders to shoot to kill. Biden wouldn't feel any of that was needed or, to put it mildly, appropriate, but then we aren't generating civil unrest and fear to create a police state.
...But fear is weaponized even more than hate by leaders who seek to spark violence. Hate is often part of the equation, of course, but fear is almost always the key ingredient when people feel they must lash out to defend themselves.
... Most tech platforms do not shut down false fear-inciting claims such as Antifa is coming to invade your town and Your political enemies are pedophiles coming for your children. But by allowing lies like these to spread, the platforms are allowing the most perilous types of speech to permeate our society.
... the Dangerous Speech Project, said that genocidal leaders often use fear of a looming threat to prod groups into pre-emptive violence. Those who commit the violence do not need to hate the people they are attacking. They just need to be afraid of the consequences of not attacking. ...
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/06/opinion/fear-speech-social-media.html
Examples of use to provoke genocides given, but right now in America what we need to fear is the "protective" choices anxious voters might make in 2024.
Oh, and the piece notes that "humor can be a good defense." Testing of poking fun at the fearmongering showed good results.

kimbutgar
(26,225 posts)We are of the same thought.
Abigail_Adams
(333 posts)if you tell them they're under attack." --Joseph Goebbels
I hate to agree, but I think you're right about fear speech.
SomedayKindaLove
(1,151 posts)And fascism is the ultimate goal of the GOP.
appalachiablue
(43,594 posts)housecat
(3,138 posts)be able to get through to these brainwashed automatons. We need a way to cut through the baked-in layers of fear and hate. I may be a naive optimist, but I believe that humor done right is stronger than guns and more effective than meds.
kimbutgar
(26,225 posts)It will help them overthrow the government if their cult leader gets back into power. Then they
will then clamp down on gun ownership and get serious about gun laws and say they are the law and order authoritarian style.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)and Impose Control for Dummies."
Sowing chaos is standard. Street violence and epidemic disease are both instruments of chaos.
And here we all are talking about this...! Thank goodness.
We've made big advances, albeit enabled by big losses, but still. In the leadup to 2016's Pearl Harbor, the "controversial" issue consuming most discussion was which national healthcare system we should choose, not whether we could lose our right to choose or have any.
"Defeat can be an integral instrument of victory." ~ Someone
LoisB
(11,804 posts)spanone
(140,370 posts)The Jungle 1
(4,552 posts)Abortion was also a powerful wedge issue for the right. They got their way with abortion and lost big at the ballot box.
The gun control wedge issue is not working in their favor either. They are stuck and do not know which way to turn.
I think the culture war will also fail.
bronxiteforever
(10,822 posts)on their motives. I also think there is a another side to this. Fear only goes so far. I am seeing more and more people from our side yelling back with righteous anger. The right has lost a generation of voters due to Dobbs and gun violence.
People are angry about the nothing being done and with that anger comes commitment to change. I think the rights ideological quicksand is fear but fear only works for so long and then people wake up. At least that is my hope.
onecaliberal
(36,594 posts)Theyre all criming in public and no one is stopping any of it.
Ferrets are Cool
(22,430 posts)rulings have. How many have to die first though?
Abigail_Adams
(333 posts)this wedge issue (guns) will fail them, too. They are the elites with big donors and connected politicos and think tanks on their side. We, the people, have tens of millions of votes. Do the AR15 worshippers think that the many families who've lost loved ones won't go to the ballot box?
Timewas
(2,542 posts)Great... I agree totally with that interpretation. What I would love to see would be some serious plans on exactly how to go about some form of real gun control.I see many many posts here that exclaim getting rid of guns but no realistic plans on how to go about accomplishing that.There are way too many to go around house to house and just confiscate them...Asking people to just turn them in will never work. There are actually some real honest reasons to have firearms. How can we get control of them and stop the crazies from having access to them? Any ideas ??
wnylib
(25,338 posts)We could also do gun buy backs. We won't get all of the guns that way, but we can reduce the numbers at least.
We can also establish deescalation centers in communities across the country to teach people, especially young people, how to descalate themselves and their own feelings as well as deescalate tense interactions that they are involved in. The point is to lead people away from weapons to resolve differences.
Some of those would work, buy backs only work to a point, mostly based on value vs. what they are willing to pay for the items, if you offer say 100$ for a 500$ item probably not work. Deescalation only works for those that actually recognize the need,red flag laws would be a huge help in that .Licensing would be great and I am all for it, as long as there is some realistic training and in depth background checks along with real privacy.
TeamProg
(6,630 posts)the American public.
The American public majority polls for more:
Gun control
Fair wages
Abortion rights
Voting rights
Affordable healthcare
Clean water
Affordable education
AND YET THE GOP STILL GETS IT WRONG.
Kablooie
(18,994 posts)The logical reaction is to get guns off the street. The emotional reaction is to allow more guns do you can defend yourself.
Republicans know emotions will win over logic.
All of the current Republican agenda is based on inciting fear.
WestMichRad
(2,702 posts)...for me, at least. The evidence certainly supports it.
In addition, they want their side fully armed and ready for rebellion.
Midnight Writer
(24,858 posts)judesedit
(4,577 posts)I bet a lot of people would go for it. At least it gets a number of guns off the street. It's an investment. And it's a start.
Bernardo de La Paz
(59,418 posts)2naSalit
(98,049 posts)The orchestrated plan to kill Democracy by any means because it doesn't work for those who are power hungry and greedy at the expense of everyone else.
Farmer-Rick
(12,095 posts)We do it with driving cars, healthcare, corporations and doctors. Why not force these gun nuts to get liability, injury, malpractice, and/or accidentally death insurance of some kind. Make them pay for the pleasure of owning deadly weapons.
Evolve Dammit
(21,267 posts)want the orange "Chosen One" back in the Oval to finish us off during the "Revenge Tour." His words, not mine.
bucolic_frolic
(52,734 posts)It's a money cycle: Shootings keep people in fear, praying, and donating to churches. The distraction from actually doing anything about guns enables the manufacture of more guns, which means more gun money for conservative politicians, which leads to nothing being done, more lack of gun regulation, and more shootings to close the loop and repeat the cycle. Churches, gun manufacturers, and conservative politicians benefit from this system. They never have to do a thing except make more money and grow their power. As a bonus they have people to hate which pleases them no end, and they get to tell themselves and each other what great God-fearing Christians they are for praying for the victims of mass shootings. Mental rigidity is a feature of religious people, MAGA, conservatives, and profitable industries.
lastlib
(26,846 posts)We know that weapons sales tick upward after these shootings. It seems that the people who buy them fancy themselves as the next Kyle Rittehouse, striking blows for "freedom" and taking down the dreaded Antifa. Keeping people in fear is their only way to maintain the dominance they seek, literally because they are so inferior that they have no other way to do it.
Backseat Driver
(4,671 posts)At least 7 killed, on purpose(?), by premeditated vehicular homicide. Update pending...
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/brownsville-texas-crash-live-seven-deliberately-ran-over-and-killed-in-car-accident-outside-migrant-shelter/ar-AA1aRMpb
Martin68
(26,544 posts)Last edited Mon May 8, 2023, 10:08 AM - Edit history (2)
propaganda campaign to persuade conservatives that they are in danger 24/7 from illegal immigrants, subhuman minorities, and rampant criminalism, many on the right do not feel safe unless they have guns. That's why they shoot people who knock on their door or look at them "the wrong way." Fox News and the rest of the toxic Right Wing media have been pounding them for decades now with the dangers they face because liberals are soft on criminals and are eager to let more immigrants into our country. They really are afraid of mean city streets and the inhabitants of our cities. I watched my parent's liberalism erode and evolve into Fox News addicts, becoming afraid of their own shadows in the process.
So, yes, many on the right are manipulating all of this for political gain and power. But the fact is, even more on the right are also unwitting victims of this process.
NoMoreRepugs
(11,662 posts)ybbor
(1,682 posts)They need the fear factor to oppress.
I totally agree with you on how easily the masses were cowed into giving up their rights for safety following 9/11. Naomi Klein does a great job referencing this exact phenomenon in Shock Doctrine. Use these episodes to your advantage to gain more control.
We are at a very, I dont want to say scary, but almost surreal point in our nations history. I hope/know we can come out of it on the positive side.
We outnumber them. Our policies, when articulated loud enough, resonate with the masses. The Dems need to start, and some are, pound out the facts! Things are better! Say it out loud!
intheflow
(29,796 posts)from whatever other eroding of rights and environmental protections they do. If everyone is talking about the latest mass shooting, no one is looking at the other crap theyre pulling.
Blue Owl
(57,581 posts)LaMouffette
(2,530 posts)all Americans, or at least it should be.
Democratic politicians do try to solve our country's problems. Just look at Obamacare, social security, the infrastructure bill, the American Rescue Plan Act, and much, much more.
But the only problem Republican politicians try to solve is the problem of getting themselves reelected. And they discovered that a sure-fire way to get Republican voters and people who don't pay much attention to politics to vote Republican is to scare the crap out of them.
But now they have a dilemma: People are becoming more afraid of getting shot at the mall, at the bank, at school, and so on, than they are afraid of immigrants crossing the border illegally and of women getting abortions.
GenThePerservering
(3,119 posts)or be resolved in any way.
Uncontrolled gun usage and slaughter is an important tool in their drive for absolute power.
Too large a part of society believes that their rights can be completely stripped away, but if they still have their guns, they are somehow "free".
ymetca
(1,182 posts)It's all just "us".
The killer is as much a victim as the killed. But this is hard to accept because it acknowledges that forgiveness requires sacrifice. You have to sacrifice your hatred, your desire for vengeance. Otherwise the cycle of violence will not cease. It's why we don't put victims in the jury box.
We have to stop with the "these people are our enemies" talk. It doesn't help. Everyone is a victim, and we're all complicit in the crime.
If turning the other cheek were easy, there'd have been Peace on Earth a long, long time ago.
Skittles
(168,011 posts)easily-controlled people indeed
ecstatic
(34,957 posts)That epiphany occurred to me earlier today: this is what they want. They are following a playbook and we need to find out what their end game is as soon as humanly possible. Many GOP governors are loosening gun laws: removing permit requirements, allowing concealed or open carry, ignoring advice from experts. Why would they be making it so much easier for these loons to buy guns?
I don't think it's just that they want everyone in fear. I think they are trying to instigate a civil war of some kind and many of the psychos who are running out to arm themselves will be their army. If my theory is true, that means some of us might need to arm up too. I don't have the stomach for it but those who do might need to. Just my opinion.
Xolodno
(7,198 posts)We often visit Mexico and friends and relatives often say "don't you think it's dangerous?" My response, "I could get shot walking by a school here in the USA". And the State Department, they often post travel notices, sometimes I think to induce people to not travel abroad. Hey, use your vacation dollars here.
Reality, stay away from questionable areas, just like you would here. Sure, that isn't always the case, but that also happens here.
If anyone remembers the movie The Village, you will note, they used fear to keep everyone in line.
LymphocyteLover
(8,868 posts)still someone has to have some reasonable solutions
LymphocyteLover
(8,868 posts)Snoopy 7
(692 posts)The only way to fix the problem is to get the money out of politics and you and I both know it won't happen. This isn't because the repubs will fight it it's because the dems won't fight for it. If you want to know why it's because you either have your ears and eyes closed or you just don't know. The repubs are starting to loose some rich sponsorship. This only means that the dems have been kissing the feet of these same rich donors. The only thing that the party changes while the money keeps flowing. The dems want the money their "colleagues" had been receiving. What you don't believe this then tell me how many times you have heard "we need to overturn/get rid of the Citizens United ruling. You haven't and won't hear those words or else the money line with either dry up or continue going to the repubs since they hand rulings/laws which help those donors (aks: donors make more money). Donors will hand out millions because they know they will make billions...
CCExile
(524 posts)The SEAT is money. The three legs are control (abortion rights, voting,etc.), salvation:fear of "the others" (salvation: from minorities, non-binaries, etc), and fetishism :guns, flags, police/miltary, etc.). The top conservative leaders know all three legs aren't real, but serve to get votes annd thus control the flow of money upwards, towards them. Without any ONE of those legs they fall. If Dmocrats could concntrate all of their efforts on only ONE LEG AT A TIME, WE WOULD PREVAIL.
ShazamIam
(2,930 posts)like unconstitutional anti-protest laws and one state even said it was ok to drive into protestsers.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/22/us/oklahoma-law-drivers-protesters/index.html
Quanto Magnus
(1,264 posts)for a while now.
Totally agree.
GQP glorify in the carnage.
Deep State Witch
(12,303 posts)Normalize it, so that people either 1) become more radicalized or 2) live in fear. Either way, it sells more guns. With the extra added bonus of eliminating the "undesirables" through mass shootings.